This is just a work in progress post: I’ve taken the Beaumont family data recently posted here as comments by B Deveson and Samuel Z, and converted (most of) them into a single über-diagram.
Please let me know if this is wrong in any way!
This is just a work in progress post: I’ve taken the Beaumont family data recently posted here as comments by B Deveson and Samuel Z, and converted (most of) them into a single über-diagram.
Please let me know if this is wrong in any way!
Nice work ^ that, ++ envy rating for an ordered mind Nick – where can I buy one?
Pete: don’t get too envious, it’s as much a curse as a blessing. 😐
flowchart fever
I think an explanation is required of why a family connection between the two Beaumont families is important. It is generally accepted that the Beaumont children would not have been lead off by a stranger. It is also relevant that 90A Moseley Street is only 1,300 meters from where the Beaumont children were last see. It is also only 1,000 meters from 109 Harding Street, where the Beaumont family lived. Also relevant is the fact that Jim Beaumont was a taxi driver in the Glenelg/Somerton Park area at the time Prosper was also driving taxis. So it must be almost certain that Prosper was well known to Jim Beaumont.
Glenelg electoral roll 1970:
968 Grant Alfred Beaumont 109 Harding Street, Somerton Park Taxi driver
I also note that “Jim’s” brother Maxwell Beaumont was a taxi driver in Adelaide in the later 1940s early 1950s.
B Deveson: a family connection between the two cases is certainly unexpected, but I have to say I’m not yet convinced that it’s important. Two sets of people in 1940s/50s Adelaide, both with decent-sized families, both (largely) Presbyterian: what actually were the odds that they would be connected somehow? 1 in 50? 1 in 100? 1 in 1000?
@nickpelling
My stats are very rusty, but I’m going to hazard a guess that it would be in the region of one in a few thousand that any two randomly selected Presbyterians in Adelaide at the time would share a great-grandparent. However, that’s making a some huge assumptions (such as presuming that Presbyterians don’t tend to cluster and intermarry in smaller regional/church/social groups, nor marry outside of their own religion) and discounts the impacts of migration, population flows and so forth.
For what it’s worth, I believe the total population of Adelaide and its suburbs was just under 400,000 at the time, and the mean percentage of Presbyterians in the Australian population was under 10 per cent (but significantly higher amongst farmers apparently, so it would be somewhat lower in capital cities). The Beaumont connection seems to be an interesting co-incidence, but hardly a staggeringly unlikely one.
Not staggeringly unlikely… But very interesting…
Very likely the two guys knew each other which connects the two cases. To what degree is still the question.
I am uncomfortable speaking ill of people in such an “armchair expert” way as I truly know nothing… But… If PT is involved in the somerton mans demise then it blows everything open.
Can someone hurry up and identify this bloke? Be so much easier working backwards 🙂
Just thought of a 1940s era taxi cruising down the road and a chill went down my spine.
William Grant Beaumont SERN 2837 Religion: Methodist
Thomas Lawson Harkness SN V215970 Religion: C of E
Prosper McTaggart Thomson VX67088 Relgion: did not give (atheist?) Buried in C of E
William Newport Grant Beaumont Religion: Methodist/Rechabite
I note that William’s nephew was the Reverend William Pennington-Bickford, rector of St Clement Dane’s church, London (ie C of E).
From memory, I don’t think the Harkness family were Presbyterians. C of E and Catholic I think.
B Deveson: some old notes of mine said that the Harknesses were (mostly) Presbyterian, but that may just have been yet another piece of Harkness-related non-information floating in the ether… sorry about that!
Incidentally, the “Jessie Muir Thomson” from Somerton Park who you mentioned in a recent comment seems to have been someone else entirely (she died on 14/10/1994 aged 76, and was perhaps born in Williamstown, Victoria?). Here’s a link to her online cremation record:-
http://www.centennialpark.org/deceased-search/deceased-search.html?view=site&PIDNO=216981&lname=thomson&fname=&year=&exact=false&maplinkid=&viewtype=detailed&limit=25&start=125 Hope that’s a help!
It appears from the comments here and the facebook page that Rachel Egan and Derek Abbott are clearly familiar outside of this case. This seems an unlikely coincidence. What are your thoughts on this Nick?
Hannah: my thoughts are the world is full of unlikely coincidences, few of which are of much consequence. For what it’s worth, I suspect that the big trick when studying history is working out which of the numerous unlikely coincidences randomly (and inevitably) connected to any given thing might actually have some meaning for (or importance to) it. 😉
Its the only piece of Validated research that is significant. And people ignore it because they would rather remain in a fantasy. Get real everyone.
A man has been murdered.
And three innocent kids have been taken from their parents.
Forget the assumptions. Ignore the fantasy.
GET REAL!
Isn’t cloning or tampering with DNA illegal?
Derek cloned the Somerton Man using hair out of the bust!
what….
the…
f…..?
Huh?
Troll?
According to your diagram Maxwell Beaumont was born in 1930 and died in 1931 – so how could he be a taxi driver?
The practice of naming children after their fathers and grandfathers was common, and if a child died, it could follow that the next male child was also given that name.
So – did you find a birth document for another Maxwell Beaumont? Did he move interstate, and was he the uncle who got locked up in Canberra in 1975 over an incident with a toy gun?
Kagyfu: according to my diagram, Maxwell Beaumont was born in 1930 or 1931. Hope that clears things up for you!
I believe somehow the father is involved. Did anyone think that sometimes the closet character is the actual perpetrator and had accomplices.
Clarice Isabella Beaumont was Nancy’s cousin or sister. Prosper Thomas and Thomas Harkness both served in WW11.
Helen – cousin or sister – makes a big difference. What makes you say/think this? Yes. Prosper and Thomas both served in WWII as did many others in this family. Is there a reason that you’ve pointed out only these two men?
Does anyone have any idea what Nancy’s maiden name is? Why does this never appear in any article/document/forum discussion about this case?
Has anyone else looked for a photograph of Prosper Thomson? I found one and it does resemble to PhotoKit of the stranger wanted for questioning in the Beaumont case. Also noted was his height ……about 6’2. I know there is a lot of suspicion that it was Mr Phipps, but everyone should be considered a suspect.
Nancy’s maiden name was Ellis, according to the Author of The Satin Man.
Tj68 – Thank you!
Was Australia day observance as a public holiday in SA adhered to re government services ie. mail deliveries and public transport. Are we absolutely certain that the eye witnesses were referring to the Wednesday and not Tuesday when the kiddies also went to the beach…Could the perpetrator have been a school or Sunday school teacher off work for the annual break and not employed on that particular day as most others would have been…I’m sure SAPOL would have covered all these angles however their plainclothes resources in those days weren’t well developed.
The latest… Mr Beaumont was an SP bookie. The Police were tapping his phone. Someone knew Beaumont was going to be in Snowtown that day.
@John Sanders:
Also looks like the indentikit of the Adelaide Oval kidnapper:
http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/news/south-australia/police-appeal-for-help-on-1973-adelaide-oval-abductions-of-joanne-ratcliffe-and-kirste-gordon-before-8216it8217s-too-late8217/story-fni6uo1m-1226703821419
Although he would have been 60+ by then, so it’s a long bow….
Maxwell John Beaumont was the uncle of the Beaumont children. He also worked as a taxi driver in the Glenelg area.
“Maxwell John Beaumont (13) summons, indecently assaulting Dorothy Jean Hayward aged 16 years & 8 months; custody and control of Children’s Welfare Dept. until 18 years of age. Consts. Mensforth and Northwood. J.C. Adelaide 7/8/45 (C11096).” South Australian Police Gazette. September 5th 1945 page 317.
If anyone has access to commonwealth police Gazettes circa. 1973-75 you will see the identikit for the Adelaide oval snatcher Also there is a photo of a wanted man (possibly cheque offences) . This fellow has a remarkable semblance to the oval perpetrater and after checking him out he was found to be a travelling fairground worker with form for molestation but without conviction. The information was passed on to sapol who passed your informant on to retired Sgt. Stan Swaine who expressed interest. Needless to say there was no reply to this young interstate detective’s information. Its maybe worth looking at again if just for the sake of closure.
Can some knowledgeable please try to explain how a young man 14 years old at most could have been issued a WW2 regular AIF service number, which would in effect have enabled the Australian military to utilize him for overseas war service. The young man was of course young Maxwell Beaumont SX500603 of S.A. and for some unknown reason we are only given 1930/31 for a year of birth. There is no online service record for him although we have it that his NOK is his father Grant so we may assume that he and Jim, who was then in Borneo were brothers. Whilst there is no record of actual war service, this may have been consistent with a policy of not puting sibling family members in the firing line at any one time. We know that Max had various occupations during his troubled life such as taxi driver, truckie and private investigator working with Stan Sleane (Det. Sgt. Sapol), though it also seems that there are many things about him that we the public have no need to know for some reason. Without infringing on the rights to privacy of the remaining Beaumonts, I can’t see any reason for us not to examine certain lines of evidence that may have relevance to our SM inquiries so long as we can somehow discourage certain pointless fanatical elements to become involved. What do you say Byron?
Mr Grant Beaumont did not have a phone on until after the bc disappearance so maybe another beaumont was the sp bookie
Ayuvirdica: Don’t mean nuthin’ whether Grant (Jim) was a starting price bookie or not; anyone with a spare quid in his sky rocket after payday in ’66 had a sneaky flutter on the nags of a Saturday arvo ; The caper was institutional, with no need for cockatoos, cause the fuz were in on the lurk. If Jim ‘laid the odds and kept a tote’ more power to him; what’s that got to do with the price of bum nuts. More’s to the point; you didn’t need a phone to run a book in them days; business was done at the local or else a vacant block nearby. The local wallopers would be either off duty or out at the local Morphetville track, checking for shorteners and reporting back betting flucktuations to the talent on the police radio. That’s how things went down in the good old days and more’s the pity that the gov’t had to get in on the deal with their rip off TAB, right about that time. If the cops were tapping phones, it was only see who was on the drum for an outsider,or who might be laying off on a dead cert.
Byron: Jim Beaumont‘s dad, the fancy Methodist, was known to all as Grant, not William or Samuel as one might reasonably expect; they being his given names and all. Jim was also a Grant, and an Alfred to boot, ala Alf Boxall aka Alec & Alf Herbert aka Xavier. So where does the Jim come from prey tell and how did he end up being C of E as attested in his AIF inlistment papers of 1943…Have you taken time to peruse Jim’s recently posted AA WW2 record which is odd, as we have not heard anything of his passing. As far as we know, he is living at his Glenelg apartment and likely still a member of the local BCOF association and a keen amateur ham? radio enthusiast. We have always known that he received a gunshot wound to his wrist/elbow at Moratai in 1945 and at war‘s end, forwent offered demobilization for favour of further service in Japan. Something quite inexplicable, by way of over the top punishment, even by military standards, occurred during Jim‘s time in the BCOF before his eventual RTA and discharge in 1947. I’m refering of course to an award of 28 days incarceration for a rather petty leave overstay of less than four hours. (unheard of). This turned out to be critical in that Jim‘s dad died just weeks before his homecoming; due to 28 days of non effective service no doubt..Care to comment on the likely effects of all this upon his immediate subsequent return to civilian life, say from 47 to 1950 thereabouts.
Does anyone have the birthdate of Nancy Beaumont nee Ellis and where she was born?
Was anyone aware that Nancy Helen Beaumont nee Ellis bn. Adelaide 1927, had in late 1947 married a certain Bronte Mourilyan Snoswell bn. 1921 Crafers S.A., who recently discharged from the RAAF and who in 1966 may have been living with his family in Chapel St. Glenelg. Off Jetty road, it appears to offer a logical shortcut via High, Partridge and Pier Sts. to Diagonal Rd., thence on to Harding St…Bronte’s dad Cleveland Frank was an invalided 50th Btn. WW1, formally a farmer and his wife, it seems was a Curry who by turn connected with the Pattersons and folks might recall that the postman witness to the kids’ home? journey was a Curry Patterson which might be a link worth considerstion.
It isn’t actually clear on whether Bronte Snoswell and Nancy Ellis were married as S.A. gene. advises, for trove merely records an engagement of the courting couple on 10th December, 1947 (year of Jim’s discharge). I have reported elswhere on Bronte’s other three marriages to Louise, Joan and Helen which seems nothing out of the ordinary with some offshoot christian sects.
I can’t find anything on Bronte’s life and times apart from what I’ve posted which seems of itself to beg more questions than answers, not only about the man but also in context of others within the Snoswell family circle. Being of a rather puritanical non conformist Chtistian sect gives rise to belief, that as an outsider and a strong willed woman, Nancy’s advances might thus be viewed as an evil enticement for the heir apparent to ‘play the harlot’. Hence Nancy being not only ousted from the fold, but also considered a likely target for retribution.
The Snoswell family had been amongst the first settlers in S.A. (1838) and were farmers who eventually settled in Crafers Nth of Adelaide in the 1870s where Bronte’s dad Cleveland grew to manhood and trained as a clerk before going off to war with the 50th Btn. Coming home an invalid of sorts he seems to have worked on the farm for a time, then married and moved to the big sprawling home on the corner of Jetty Rd and Chappel street. Apart from his two overseas trips to New Zealand in retirement, nothing else crops up until his death in an Adelaide aged care home in the 1980s
First born was Bronte bn. 1921 followed in turn by Jean and then John in 1928 and that’s about all we can discern about specifics, accept our man’s service in WW2 which we are not at liberty to read unless we pay, nothing at all on sister Jean who may not have survived childhood. John’s life is also blank apart from him having died at Keith in 2014 leaving wife Dot and three children, likely two daughters and a son, one of whom married in 1975. He seems to have been well regarded and loved by all according to the nice Billion dollar graves photo at Keith Cemetery.
There is a nice photo of Cleveland on line, in his uniform and having just been officially welcomed home from the war by a townsfolk at Crafers. He looks a good style of a fellow, tall with fair hair a fair complexion and athletic. From the very clear picture, his movie star he-man good are well defined, along with a nonchalant air of confidence that stands out. What his son’s looked like is anyones guess, though if one considers the more selective breeding as applied in those times, much alike would be a fair guess.
Should it be of interest, whilst our Mac. Sands directory lists the Snoswells at 6 Chapel St. in 1950, the current Glenelg grid map lists only a number 4 main dwelling at cnr of Milton St. on the way up to High Street. I note that the Uniting Church, once run by the Congregationalists as were the Snoswells, was but a hop step and a jump for Glory across the road from their domain. Perhaps Cleveland officiated on Sundays and his children taught Sunday school to local kids, perhaps even our two missing Beaumont girls.
It sure is late in the day, but nothing seems to be doing since Helen’s passing last year. Im wondering whether anyone knows where the weird names Nartare and Arrna derive as they seem not consistant with names of close family on either side, or anywhere else. I dId a little digging around her dad’s war records, both 1 (LH Gallipoli) and 2 (Trg), but apart from his being pre service labourer, Bapist and WIA/2 his service including 53 days down with Cairo sniffle seemed not unusual, living to near eighty in Adelaide God bless’im.
DaveDewie: A much belated reply on Nancy Ellen (Helen) Ellis’ personal details, indicate that she was born in 1927 at Bowden to Montefiore Athol and Ellen Ellis. Her dad, 1893/1970, was a Gallipoli veteran, serving with 3 LH and discharged in 1919. North Adelaide was listed as the address when announcing her engagement to Bronte Mourilyan Snoswell of Glenelg 12/47, he having been married to a Joan Lynas of Melbourne whilst in the RAAF during ww2 (fishy).
milongal: I’m in need of a bit of Glenelg business district info. Jetty Road end of Moseley, city side there’s a book store/newsagency at 4B and takeaway joint next door at 6. What I’m looking for his a possible narrow walkway between the two that gives access to Milton and carries through to Chapel and on to an old church entrance where they intersect. Opposite is 4 Chapel according to my aerial view and though It’s now conduminiums, in ’66 it must have been a rabbit warren of two block widths (inc. No. 6) from what I understand. I’m figuring that the kids may have left Wensels cake shop at 2 Moseley (Cnr. Jetty) and used that breezeway? as an intended back route home to 109 Hardy St. between Brighton & Diagonal Rds.
Beaumont kids are a fraction before my time, but…..
That part of Moseley used to be the Glenelg Bus Terminus (from memory all terminating services ended Southbound (and would begin their “up” journey in that direction, turning Left High St, Left Partridge (and then diverge to their various routes). I *think* there were 2 Southbound stops at the terminus (along the shopfronts). There was also a Northbound stop, that was used by services passing through from further South (I remember the 266 from Seacliff v Brighton, and at one time there was a variant 264 that used to start/finish at Glenelg (it might have been the only service to start Northbound, although I have some vague idea that there might have been a service via West Beach that might have started Northbound then Left Jetty, Right Colley, Right Anzac Hwy Left Adelphi and up military road (it would have originally been the 278 or 275 (I forget which was which) and later 138 and 135). And there was a non-city service that used to run Port Adel to Marino (340/345) via a whole bunch of places including Glenelg. This was later replaced by a whole slew of overlapping city-bound services (not sure how they replaced Port->West Lakes, then 137/139 (West lakes to City) to Henley, 110 (City to Marion v Henley, Glenelg)). But as ever we digress…..
Might have to do some research into what bus would they have been given money for that went to Glenelg. In my living history there have been few buses that went to Glenelg from Diagonal road. Currently it looks like the 190 and the 300 might, but they’re pretty recent. In my lifetime, I can remeber a 248 that serviced that part of Diagonal road (but did not goto Glenelg), the 110 (but that didn’t come in until about 2005) – the 110 loosely replaced the 340, which might have followed a similar route from Glenelg (and I think dates to the 1980s) [I know it ended at Marino Rocks, but can’t remember if it serviced Marion – if it did, it would most likely have used Diagonal Rd). Might be a question for the gunzels at BusAustralia forums….
I don’t remember an alley to Milton St (or into the back of the of Our Lady of Victories (I’m sure I grew up thinking it claimed the status Basilica Minor – but can’t find a reference at the moment other than to a church of the same name in Vic – but that’s only since ’96…..).
But….I could imagine a pathway through to Milton St (though I don’t definitively remember one). On Google Maps there’s a definite gap between the shops on Moseley (and an alley at least half way through), but it looks like therse days that hits the property at #4 Milton – question is whether that would always have been the case and/or whether there was different access through there…..or whether people are willing to short cut across fences if it comes to it – #4 is listed “Vacant” in 1967 S&M (and is also listed as holiday flats around that time) – so it’s quite possible there was access through there
Also, would you mean “Harding” rather than “Hardy” st? (109 would be corner Peterson).
Finally,I assume you know there’s also a Wenzels further up near Brighton Road ?
JS, Milongal. There are B&W aerial photographs from 1936 or thereabouts. I checked these years ago re street lights on the Esplanade, sea walls, tide marks etc.
With a liitle help from Domain R.E. Glenelg, I’m looking down a narrow paved breezeway running through to Moseley exit at Nos. 4 & 6B from along the front of No. 4 Milton. It would have been a pedestrian walkway in the past without doubt, though these days it’s see through gated. So here’s the deal as it might have been on Australia day 1966 when the kids left Wenzels on Mosley/Jetty cnr.with their purcases around 11.30am. They either chose or were directed to take the alternate route home to 109 Harding St., a distance of maybe two kilometers which was in all probability known to them. They would have turned down the laneway leading to Milton St. and within a few yards, were apparently met by a person or persons unknown, laying in wait or even by prior arrangement, who might have then taken them into No 4 and laid groundwork for the next phase of whatever had been the intention, one which would probably include live transfer of the kids well away from the area, to what end who knows.
No. 4 Milton Street was an unoccupied nondescript brick cottage built on a cnr. block with perhaps two entrances, one off the lane and t’other facing along Milton St. towards Chapel St. A widow Nora Mendelson had been a long term resident until her death in late 1965 and of course other local residents including Nancy Beaumonts’s ex intended, whose then family home at 4 Chapel would likely have provided vantage of the the laneway entrance and goings on therein if he was himself the kingpin. Three months or more later, a woman told police she had observed three children being escorted (forced?) into a vacant house off a laneway in the locality of where they were last seen. Later that evening she saw a small boy being roughly handled in the laneway and taken back indoors. The woman told cops that next day the house had been vacated.
milongal: Apologies, got a bit carried away with my main quest and as fortune would have it, the bus stop for the kid’s return home looks to have been right there on Moseley next to my laneway. Thanks for lecture re on the buses, most enlightening, really and yes I knew about the other Wenzel’s shop, as for my Hardy St. slip; hardly my fault considering Harding St. is a mere two hundred yards north and heading in the same easterly direction. Glenelg street naming board obviously got off on the same bus as the Baumont case detectives. What sort of coppers are going to spend years on a single 30s something suspect, seen playing with the kids, who had approached witnesses in order to ensure a good description being circulated at the outset.
Jim and Nancy were apparently married in 1955, split up in the seventies, divorced about 1980 and from what we’re told remained in the Somerton area, Nancy dieing last year after a long period of poor health. My last check on Jim was that he lived alone at 1/44 The Boulevard and was in excellent health for his years though he may now be living in an aged care facility. Nancy was laid to rest as Beaumont which does seem to gel with media claims that neither she nor Jim had remarried, though I’m not so sure. Her former husband/fiance from the 40s, Bronte, who had passed in 1990, married for the third or fourth time in 1981, his as yet untraced spouse named as Helen. That being Nancy Beaumont nee Ellis’ middle name is hardly something that Sapol would not check into right?.
milongal: Actually I managed to come up with a great ’59 Glenelg city centre shot with of all things, a bus parked a few meters sth of Wenzel’s on Moseley, right beside my breezeway entrance. As for the mysterious No. 6 Chapel St. occupancy or not, I have H.E. Whittle there in ’47 who could have been then recently deceased Detective Harold Edgar, or perhaps more likely bookmaker Henry Edwin who died in 1956…Byron: Thanks for the info on pre ’40s pics that reveal no sign of street light poles south of The Boulevard, which neither Peteb and star witness Strapps seem to have been made aware of.
@JS: I sort of alluded to it above, #4 is listed vacant in ’66 (or was it ’67) but in other years is listed as holiday accommodation. As such, it wouldn’t surprise me if the gate wasn’t there and it was (quite deliberately) accessible through the breezeway (have a look on the satellite view on Google maps, and the awning for #4 lines up with the alley – but could be a later addition. as people claimed/reclaimed property. There also may have been a path through what is now the back yard of 4 & 2, to the shop access at the rear of the Jetty Rd shops.
I had a bit more of a look into the buses. Routes loosely similar to the 340 (or later 110) would be the #33 (returns as #34) – Port Adelaide to Glenelg (Eventually via West Lakes, Military Rd, Seaview Rd). Problem is, that that doesn’t appear to have continued to Marino (or even it’s anagram Marion). There’s a mention on the Bus Australia site that the 340 was a result of merging the 33 and the 665 (Glenelg to Marino) in the ’80s – so I guess the next step is to look up when the 665 service ran (I wonder if public bus routes are something that’s gazetted)
There’s a promising thread on busaustralia (in the South Australia forums, “History of Bus, Tram & Train Services” – around the 21st (of 40-odd) page of posts a poster called “The Mayor”** promises to give a history on routes including 665 “soon” – if I have time I’ll look for it, otherwise someoen else feel free if you’re that way inclined (he also mentions in another post some history around the St Leonards service).
**I’m reasonably sure that at least one of the Adelaide experts was a Bus Operator out of Port Adelaide (or its Satellite depot at Hendon) at the same time I was based at Port Adelaide – but I have never worked out exactly who “The Mayor” was (who from memory was one of the people I think was at Hendon). but perhaps his experience pre-dates when I was there……
When police started their investigation on this high profile child abduction case, it becomes clearly obvious that they put all their resources towards finding one particular suspect and nothing mire, contrary to all the long established rules for good detective practice. Looking through some old search indices not previously accessed by investigators confirms my long felt beliefs that there was no serious initiative directed towards any other possible motives for the kid’s disappearance, other than that promoted by the bloodlusting press hounds. Logical progression after the initial hue & cry had come up empty, should have included possibility by family members which is standard pack drill in cases involving multiple children.
Had such inquiries have transpired, a wealth of extremely enlightening information was there for any investigators having the the ability to process it for relative merit. Jim Beaumont’s WW2 service record seems fairly innocuous on tge surface, but deep within, it conceals some serious social misdeed which his superiors sought to cleverly conceal in interests of military expediency with a prison sentence totally at odds with the petty crime described. Had the Angas St. CIB ckecked on his brother Max their hackles would certainly have been raised in noting that his juvenile record included agravated sexual assault (rape) on a young lady, for which he was sentenced to incarceration til aged eighteen. Then of course there was the kid’s mother Nancy’s 1947 betrothal to local charmer Bronte Snoswell of Glenelg who had one marriage under his belt by then, not to mention puritanical sect member kith and kin showing up in all sorts of unsettled inhospitable malley country hidey holes.
on comercial real estate it was listed in Spetmber and there’s some pic s including on th edriveway/alleyway (it’s also on domain, and there’s an older version on realestate but it doesn’t have external pics).
Irrespective whether that was or wasn’t originally supposed to be an alley, I’m sure it would have been used as such if it wasn’t gated (or if it was poorly gated).
Should SA AG Vickie Chapman be following recent events I think she may now need to give some consideration to the very real possibility of the so called Beaumont children abduction case being resolved at long last and with a happy ending well worth a million to me tax free. I’ve now satisfied myself at least, after fifty years of believing that motivation for the crime was more likely born out fear and concern for the welfare and future of her babies, as opposed to the stalking child predator scenarios that newshounds lust for, but for which there was little basis in this instance. This opposed to the 1973 Adelaide Oval crime involving a true deviant which my old associate Detective Killer Swain tried to tell his mockers.
Somehow or other I think tha poor Nancy Beaumont had come to the belief, whether real or imagined that her babies were in harms way in some form that we should not try to fathom, the passion of motherhood being something of an inigma in itself. I believe that she had put a deal of thought into the planning and execution of her children’s disappearance, with some female involvement, but mostly with help of her former husband or partner Bronte. The planned event for the last day before the kids were to start a new school year went off without a hitch, the kids being kept in a safe house til heat died down, then relocated far away and rebadged accordingly as members of a well off caring family.
I’ve taken the liberty of informing Sapol and others of my recent inquiries, results of which confirm to my satisfaction at least, that the two youngest children Grant and Arrna are very much alive and well as David Grant and Helen, now in their mid to late middle age, one married the other apparenly single and both residing not too far from their old childhood home in Somerton. I have obtained a recent photo of one of the pair which even after the passage of time still reveals distinctive matching facial features. As for Jane, I have named her as jillian , her husband as David also along with 1975 the year of marriage, but I sense that they living in a quiet rural area.
You’ve outdone yourself, Johnny.
Bumpkin: Johnny, Johnny..Few ever called me that, never knew if it was a form of endearment or whetger it be a cloaked threat. Old forward scout that I once was, I still stay allert to the possibilites of ambush. Reminds me that the jungle is neutral.
Mostyn Matters of Glenelg CIB was a hard nosed detective, one of the old school which accords with typical intros of Safcol (sic) dicks ie. Cramer on Feltus. He was apparently the first suit to interview the Beaumont parents, Jim & Nancy on day one 1966 and one of those who took statements the following day from bus driver Munroe? who delivered the kids to Glenelg and a flip flopping local postman Tom Patterson who in the first instance gave a pm sighting and changed it to am by the following day. Mostyn met up with Tom in 2009 at invitation of the Adelaide press (for want of a better word) and the pair were photographed as they discussed the old days, then got down to tin tacks going over events of that fateful Australia day Wednesday back in 1966. Both were retired of course and can be forgiven some memory lapses, with Tom passing not long after.
I have a lot of problems with Toms alleged accounts of his mail route that day and I’m not even sure that letter deliveries would have been resumed in the afternoon, it being long held convention that government services like the PMG would give postal workers an unofficial half day off to celebrate take over from the not so celebratory first Australians in 1788. I’m sure somebody would have gotten to the bottom of that one, and also Tom’s little fib about knowing the Beaumont kid’s from numerous previous interactions with them, ie. ‘Here’s the postie’ then racing each other to get the daily mail first. Problem being with any mid morning and mid afternoon deliveries, the girls would be in class so how did they become so pally. But they’re not the only problems I have with this witness Your Worship.
According to his numerous confidants in the press Tom, who had been on the job since 1934 from memory, heard the bugle call when war came and rushed off to do his patriotic duty for the cause no matter the consequences. In later years, he was most reluctant to talk about his active service, modestly admitting if really pushed that yes, he served overseas, saw action in a frontline infantry battalion but would rather keep his own coursel on such personal events. Only truth in this claim was the word ‘infantry’, the rest being a load of cobblers for Tom didn’t see any action and the farthest north he ever got was when his 10/48 Battalion deployed to Narellan NSW in a defence role. Question arises then, how much of our posties yarn with Mostyn in ’66 was fair dinkum and how much blarney..It ‘Matters’ I’m sure.
Well what d’ya know, I was for once mistaken. It seems that wedding bells for Arrna (Helen) and her first cousin in 1981, of which record I had assumed to be a reference to her uncle Bronte’s possible re-up to Nancy Beaumont. At first bluff one might be inclined to disbelief. Not so in this case for of course the kids having been adopted post 1966, they could morally and quite legally marry into their adoptive family which, God bless her, she did..speaking of which I’m in the market for a very skilled law firm dealing in family matters who are prepared to represent my upcoming petition to the SA Attorney General, on a pro bono basis, one which would undoubtedly open a few doors if the case be proven.
John, back in 1966 we still had mail deliveries on Saturday morning. Even in small country towns and there were often two posts, early and a late on every day.
Byron: I’ll give it to your seniority (slight) on the recall front for Saturday mail and indeed I read something to that effect somewhere. I was however referring to Australia day which fell on the Wednesday, with school set to resume the following Monday after the six week holiday period. In some non official government sectors, perhaps even the suburban post offices, they took a half day off, I just don’t remember. Patterson had seemed to be quite certain of his going off to the war, albeit not in any hurry (1942) which is not backed up by his record, so there is some concern about his truth telling re events to which he was witness in 1966.
JS, Yes, you are right to question Tom’s story, particularly as he changed the timing from PM to AM. It all points to very poor police work IMHO.
Detective Swaine was a fine investigator and never gave an inch to his in house critics, even relishing his enigma status and not caring one iota of being ridiculed by the perfumed cuff & collar toyboy dicks from Glenelg and Adelaide CIBs in the ’60s and early 70s. He was a no frills outspoken and unorthodox chap so when a young interstate fed hit him with a lead on a like MO suspect for the two Adelaide child nappings, he was sternly admonished for the typically flawed stand on both being any way related. In his view the Oval crime was one involving opportunistic preditation by a deviant and conversely that of the earlier Beaumont children, a well planned and executed uplifting for a different purpose altogether. Despite detractors saying, that on his deathbed the old nutter spoke of kids buried in a suburban churchyard, that could well have been his take on the second ’73 Oval abduction.
On the occasions that the brash interstate suit spoke to him, Stan would not even countenance the thought that Grant and his sisters were likely deceased… He had driven in from pre retirement leave at Port Elliott in order to send a message to all and sundry; not to fall into the trap of Sapol complacency, but instead ‘backtrack’ for answers to the conundrum. ‘Killer’ Swaine often spoke in riddles, liking the kids to brave ‘young lions’ who, in spite of life’s hurdles, woud always be there to give succor to each other. Whilst heeding the old detective’s advice in general, It was so difficult to figure whether he intentionally used words like ‘backtrack’ and ‘young lions’ as a suttle hint to some form of cryptic clue for revealing the means of an eventual breakthrough in the decades old case..Not until now that is and when it finally hits home to others, the most enlightening solution becomes plain, clear and ever so obvious. No mistake about it, the Beaumont kids are out there still in touch and successful in their lives, which may afterall have been the reason for their uplifting and conversion. Dare we to intrude on their privacy?
One other thing that may bare some considerstion, in more ways than one, might be related to the kids having been to the beach the day previous to their alleged abduction. Seems that dad Jim had taken them there but they could have made the home journey unescorted, either by bus or walking the two kilometers or so by a known back route. There’s that to take in and the added possibility that forgetful postie Tom Patterson may also have gotten the two days mixed, though I’m sure that proposution would have been raised on day one by Mostyn Matters anors.
Was Australia Day Observed in 1966 (I know it dates from the 1830s and was referred to as Australia Day by 1930s, but I thought noone really cared about it until about the 1970s (stand to be corrected))?
Was it gazetted as a Public Holiday in SA (a) On the day (b) on the closest Mon or Fri (c) not at all?
FWIW SA is a bit funny with public holidays. Until recently, I think SA still considered Sundays to be gazetted Public Holidays (even now, I think shops are stricytly 11-5 in most of the metro area). Christmas Even and New Years Eve used to be gazetted as part public holiday (I think after 7PM), which was naturally a bonza in terms of pay rates when you did the New Years Eve services on the buses….
JS, somebody, on one of the Satin Man blogs, claimed that SAPOL were not previously aware that Max had relevant form. Do you happen to know if this is true? I note that there are irregularities in Max’s service record (moved from a custodial sentence to the army at age 15) and he was a taxi driver in Glenelg in the 1940s. I also note that he drew a gun on somebody in the 1960s in a pub and has otherwise kept a very low profile with almost no public records.
Byron: My first impression of those perfumed, fairies from Angas St. in 1967 was not impressive, on the contrary those I encountered were a bunch of sniggling buffoons. My next encounter in 74 or 75 was equally unimpressive and I doubted that any were trained investigators as was manditory in other states. They had no idea whatsoever about what went down in the Beaumont case and to my way of thinking they took their leads from the press based on hearsay and inuendo. Their handling of the matter was uncoordinated and blase in the extreme and nothing has changed demonstrably to this day in my opinion as a former detective. They never checked on uncle Max’s weird military record or his rap sheet for being a potential suspect based on his gazetted sexual assault of a teenaged girl in 1945 at 15 years of age. The gun incident in Canberra many years after the alleged child abductions was probably due to alcohol fueled accusations of his involvement in which he threatened his drinking mate with a water pistol. Max had apparently lived in both Port Adelaide and north Glenelg prior to the kids going missing and afterterwards became a private eye.
Everyone is invited to have a go at my cryptic phrase clue for finally solving this cold case investigation that has counfounded Safcol (sic) for a half century. It is considered close to what Detective Stan Swaine may have been pondering over in his determined quest for a resolution to no avail. It being reference to a surname that the abducted? kids were thought to have later been known by. This name is based on the given sub text ‘welsh pride-about face’ which I derived from a like term which was more confusing than a clue. I deciphered it fairly easy, though by then I’d had the name under scrutiny for some time from another developement.
Anyhow get going and whoever comes up with the name, don’t opinionise which may lead to sledging from our usual detractors.
It’s ten days since I put out feelers to Newscorp through resident Beaumont case man plus Sapols cold case detective ‘Dutchy’ van der Stelt, and after a decent on line interval with nothing to show to date points to lack of initiative. Scoop Littlely’s reluctance to engage no doubt stems from his status quo belief that any one of a dozen deceased psychos is the culprit, and as for Sgt. Leo the lion van de Stelt, his slow response brings to mind Banjo’s ‘Pearl Diver’ ditty with cruel reference to the ‘lumbering Dutch’ or similarly that crazed nazi fanatic labeling them as bumbling Netherlanderthals. Of course Safcol’s Constable plod might just as easily be a S.A, Quorn born St. Peters College dux so better not to be so judgemental in his case.
It can be seen that nine year old Jane’s middle name Natarre and younger sister’s first name Arnna share common origins, as with Ariana, applicable to daughter of Helen and Bronte, latter being presumed son of Bronte Mourilyan Snoswell and third wife Joan Estelle nee Lynas. Anyone still present might recall that Bronte Snr. had wed or at least become engaged to Nancy Helen Ellis in ’47 eight years before she teamed up with Grant ‘Jim’ Beaumont. No need to remind that Helen Snoswell and Bronte Snoswell would not earn first cousin status if adoption of either party had been involved. Unfortunately Bronte is MIA and Helen although famed as a stage costume designer, is known to be shy in the extreme. It appears that this Snoswell family, Ariana included live near patriarch Cleveland’s old place in Glenelg right where the charade? started out. My pics of the two sisters are not likely to be of any use for facial recognition comparison to the girls circa. 1965, due to the age discrepencies and in that the older pair are pretty solid. Unlike brother David Grant who is still trim taught and terrifically alike his four year old part namesake of old.
An unfortunate though unavoidable error on my part re incorrect Helen Snoswell of Glenelg link. There are two of Helen Snoswells with same age, same marriage year 1981 and now sorted out thank goodness so now back on track with the correct Helen/Bronte family relatativety match-up.
Stefano: Two additional possible ex Beaumont surnames are known, each of three having a prominant connecting ‘O’ sound relative to jill (Jane), HelenByron (Arnna) and David Grant (Grant). All come with comparison pics though no need to post or elaborate at present; it being best to keep certain ‘disturbing elements’ at bay.
ps: Try the simple partly decrypted name puzzle inset above though you’ll need an authorised john sanders translator such as comrade Bunke.
Byron: A little mistake on my part re Max Beaumont in that his weapon of choice in 1975 was a Cap gun and not a water pistol, upshod of which he was placed on a GB bond. I doubt whether he was ever a person of interest in the abductions of 1966 however a couple of points of interest come to mind.apart from his rape? conviction in ’45. He married Mae apparently while still a teenager and it ended in divorce by ’54, after which he must have been hitched again, for he mentioned two dependant children in ’76 when living at Evatt ACT and there was a babe who died at birth back in Adelaide in ’65..Be nice if someone with a spare forty bucks could pull his NAA file.
The Llewsons, John and Dot were newly wed prospective farmers lured to the arid ninety mile desert in S.A.’s Mallee by cheap loans and to capitalise on the CSIRO’s new developement in soil nutrients designed for high yield, low nutrient fodder crops such as lucerne, on land that wouldn’t feed an ant normally. They cultivated an immense desolate wilderness selection far from civilization, much of which now forms part of a huge restricted nature preserve. The couple passed on a few years back having lived in virtual isolation for 60 years, by which time three of their four children had all by then left the area and who would now be nearing retirement age, with families spread far and wide throughout S.A. Although the old couple were interred only two years apart in a local cemetery, they don’t seem to have become known to locals but for a farm access road named for them, their former presence being but a vague memory to perhaps a few older residents. It is not known whether the kids, two of each born in the late fifties and early sixties were of their blood or adopted and there aren’t any habitation records in the S. A. S & Mc register up until 1973. Folks such as John and Dot, originally from Glenelg may have choosen to isolate themselves from normal society if they harboured some deep family secret that they wished to be kept safe in perpetuity.
Does everyone go to Canberra? Max in Evatt, Boxall in MacGregor (about 4 suburbs away on opposite sides of Belconnen (MacGregor to the West, Evatt to the East)).
Sort of surprised how transient people seem to have been (although I guess anyone with a service history is probably used to shifting)
Milongal, and Robin lived in Canberra for a few years.
Of four children raised on the farm by John and Dorothy Llewsons, only the one managed to be named for publication in the Adelaide birth pages of 1958. John Richard went out and got work as a trainee stock auctioneer at aged 16 and travelled far and wide in his 47 years in the game, finally settling in the Adelaide Hills and retiring with wife Chris a few days ago. Why he up and left home at such a tender age rather than stay to work the land with his dad is anybody’s guess, and why his older sister Jill and the two younger kids Helen and David Grant were not so named in the birth lists, might be considered suspiciously out of character by some.
Byron: Gough then Malcolm overlapping, were there same time as Max. Some sort of coincidence or what?.
Bumkin: A bit of your well known wisdom if you feel up to it. I was mistaken about young Richard; he was infact born in 1957 though the day and month are not yet known. His sisters Jill and Helen were billed as having arrived, one each side of their brother in 1956 and 1958, but yet again without full details to confirm actual identity. My question being, would yiu be knowing the odds of no fault so called ‘Irish Triplets’?. The Llewsons family grew by one two years later in 1961/62 when David Grant arrived, though his arrival details if accurate, certainly didn’t make news headlines, leastwise not in South Australia where he was born.
In a perfect Columbo, true detective world I’d be free to provide details for the trio showing that their births all came within a twenty five month period, which whilst not gestationally unheard of, makes one feel that things are coming together along theoreical plot lines. Having access to all three by any number of direct means, my spirit of integrity, but mostly fear of possible later repersussions prevents such indiscreet approaches so I bide my time. In David Grant’s case, I was able to track him through various colleges and employment situations in both Australia and the eastern US state of Ohio, but alas my attempts at sniffing out personal details through the proper channels have met with beurocratic privacy concerns and of course the ever pervasive paywall.
For any still following the somewhat non topical ‘Beaumont Connection’ thread; With respect to the younger children, Arnna 11/11/58 and Grant 12/7/61, there was apparently no newspaper family notification of their births or mention of their parents had they not been named at delivery time. With Jane 10/9/56 there was press notice given with full details though with a wrongly spelt middle name…It might be worth mentioning that there had been a nameless daughter born into my suspect family in 1954 which was also press covered, though I’m quite satisfied that the child did not survive to be christened, even though there is no mention of demise or burial.
The ‘Llewsons’, John and Dot, who had been farming several localities on Yorke Peninsular in the post war period, bought a 950 acre unimproved property, 407 Hundred of Coombe near Ngarkat in July 1963 with dad’s help. First knowledge of a physical presence was recorded only in 1973 when it was described as being a mixed farm, but with no further detail apart from ownership and maps of the flat desert landscape still show no signs of permanant habitation; it being paid off in 1978 and sold in 1988. When the old couple died recently at Keith hospital only their eldest daughter? Jill was still living in the area, aged 65 and married to a local fellow Dave C since 1975.
I’m wondering whether some form of service is intended to mark the 55th anniversary of the Beaumont kiddies disappearance tomorrow (Australia Day). The Bible speaks of number 55 also having connotations to little angels which of itself would denote acceptance of the commonly held abduction/murder theory. Nancy Beaumont was cremated in 2019 at Centenial Park cemetery but it is not known whether her ashes or a memorial plaque mark her passing, which would be an appropriate venue if so. For Adelaidians interested in being part of any such gathering, attendance could include both folks paying homage to loss souls and perhaps others with quite a different reasons. As far as I’m aware Nancy had no known relatives other than her husband Jim and children Jane, Arnna and young Grant, who would be/are now aged 65, 63 and 59 respectively.
We are often accustomed to hearing of doting parents who, after losing their babies in tragic circumstances, like that presumably faced by the Beaumonts, not being able to cope with the heartbreak and having succumbed to their grief within a short time. It would seem however, that Nancy & Jim were made of hardier stuff, being more resistant to the effects of common human emotions, both living long lives and kept going by tge father’s oft stated certain knowledge that the event in 1966 was plainly for relocation and that his kids would not have been physically harmed. Of course that optimism could be based on any one of several factors, including most assuredly, there being not one scintilla of evidence to prove any other consequence of the abduction.
Apart from Jim’s BMCE incarceration in Japan allegedly from of a four hour AWOL fizzer which was likely IMO a recird cover-up for some unmentionable crime, two non service related items numbered 20/21 in his NAA file are of additional interest. They seem related to a possibly anonymous information of more recent times involving Jim’s Christmas greetings to ‘all’ at SCMA from G. Beaumont with the original sender’s name (in blue) crossed out. SCMA were (still are) rural oriented FM radio stations serving isolated communities on local issues and fire emergency information ie. Ngarkat region of S. A., which was where John, Dorothy and their children? were living post 1966.
So much for the Rechabite thing with Jim Beaumont’s family, his dad William Grant getting done for drunkedness in France 1918 and his uncle Albert scoring a good dose of Cairo sniffle even before getting a crack at Johnny Turk in 1915. Nosing around a bit, I note that our Snoswell patriarch Cleveland, his wife Gladys and an A. Beaumont, both of Glenelg, sailed for Blighty on a Cooks Tour in late ’51. Uncle Albert may uave lived at 18 South Esplinade in those days right on the beach, with Cleve’ and his family not far away at 6 Chapel St. off Milton and Jetty, both WW1 lads likely connected through Glenelg RSL.
Seems the joe nabs are on the march, a little late but hungry for morsels none the less. I suggest the next move would be to get a hold of our two tentative b-in- law’s NAA files ie. Max Beaumont SX500605 and Bronte Mourilyan RAAF WW2 to check for any splash of colour, plus the latter’s SA Gazette of 1941 outlining a Woodside police arrest based on information of his dad Cleve which may prove to be most helpful. They owned a farm thereabiuts and the kids would have spent weekends or School breaks up there as well as at Grandad John Mourilyan’s Crafers mansion and also at shy uncle Bert’s big spread out Curramulka way. This mob were also known to have the succor of their Kirk hard by wherever they were, places like Chapel St. Glenelg, out in their western dominions and of course Ngarkat (Keith) post ’66 all had strong Puritan Congreagationalist following. John C. in particular was into divinity studies at St. Peters College and was no doubt against the Uniting Church amalgamation in the seventies, prefering Martin Luther’s mob apparently.
Quite a bit to catch up on for those who are interested over yonder at Big Footy and the two Somerton Man Ultimate sites. A bit early and mostly uneccessary for worries about exhumations for DNA comparisons, just yet anyways, due mainly to our suspected abductees being very much alive and contactable via Facebook and the like, their wherabouts being known. Suggest Moncom, Greycloud and Tue take in all that has been posted and not bother so much with second guessing which is repetetive self serving imo. They might try for something I have not been able to achieve to date discreetly ie., obtaining legal birthdates of the Llewsons, on the offchance that they match up with Jane, Arnna and Grant’s. Also a fifth gen. sister of Bronte/John, Jean Gladys who married Max? in 1946 was still living when her sister in-law Dorothy died of dementia at Keith 2017 and may have some rare knowledge. things. PS: A listing of all extended family can be found on both John and Dot’s ‘Centralian’ funeral notices on line.
Now that the naysayers are up and running their typical hah nah game, totally expected and on time, I might add that I did not come to my decisions for disclosure of a more viable solution without a good deal of comparison of photographic evidence to help me with deliberations and determination on the probabilities of match up. I’m not yet ready for release kids, in the interests of discretion of course.
I’d say more subjective thought required from the 25 watters over BigFooty where usual deviant suspects seem to have held sway since 2012. They say can’t happen and BS because, the kids would have come to the realisation of their predicament and notoriety of their Australia Day abduction in due course. Then they would assuredly have gotten the word out of their horrid time in enforced incarceration. Only thing being, the word would suffice not only to cause a lot of pain and future readjustment problems for themselves, but so too cause a world of pain for their natural parents Jim & Nancy at home hoping and praying for their return, plus the well to do criminally complicit Llewsons family, hidden away from prying eyes and social conciousness in their blissffull non conformity out at Ngarkat.
Not so long ago I posted on another site regarding a photograph in which police and media erred in their identification of Jim Beaumont being one of those in the frame. This particular pic resulted in a deal of press attention back in the day due to some things that Nancy had to say about an unidentified woman friend who was with the family standing next to a caravan somewhere on Yorke Peninsular in May ’65….Its a sad but telling indictment that in all the years since, neither Jim or Helen saw fit to bring to light the misidentification, or of equal concern provide a name for this man with his right hand on Nancy’s shoulder and the other on Jane’s head, a sign of a effectionate relationship no less.
Amongst 19 items listed by police as having been carried by the kids on their ‘intended’ trip to the beach, four were superfluous for such a brief outing.
Their scanty manner of dress would be typical of young children of that time, especially in that they lived close by. The items included a novel carried by shy Jane ‘to impress’ as well a white money cum accessory purse and a hair clip which may have belonged to short haired Arnna. An airline carry all bag, ‘for towels’ seems a bit over the top, in that most kids would prefer to simply drape towels around their necks. I’m inclined to the unpopular view that the purse was for carrying an additional sum such as a one pound note and that aforesaid carry bag likely carried extra clothing and toiletries intended for an extended period away from home.
Based on impeccable authority, State Library of S.A. has a considerable amount of Snoswell family documents &c. dating back to John Snr’s arrival aboard ‘Africane’ from Deal Kent via Kangaroo Island in 1836. Included is a volume of family pics dating from 1865 to 1967, which might then be available for viewing and even photo copying to bona fide ‘First Fleet’ researchers like us…Lib. Ref. PRG 912 series (Snoswell John & Decendants). My advice, get in early to avoid the rush and don’t forget who gave you the good oil.
Things have gone quiet on the dedicated ‘Big Footy Beaumont’ site possibly as a consequence of an intended diversion from the tired ‘usual suspect’ scenarios, for which I make no apologies. I have laid out my case for abduction based on a more desireable outcome for the kids and well intended abductors which involved resettlement with a caring family. This in all probability involved a near to normal upbringing, with likely knowledge of at least one of their natural parents. Should curious or plain undecided folk be at all interested, I have compiled some brief additional thoughts regarding the trio’s last hitherto unmentioned Glenelg sighting plus a reconstruction of probable movements and events thereafter. This can be found in more detail on the ‘Ultimate Somerton Man/Random stuff’ blog.
Wait a minute .. how come you’re back on there when I was disqualified for life?
I don’t think there’s anyone at home these days. Perhaps Gordon can manage another easy takeover for his plotting & brewings then shred all the past input by celebrated authors, you included ala anemptyglass…I see you’ve got a John Gacy dead spitter on side and now he’s here under his own name giving some views on poor Tibor’s Hungarian letter construction or similar. More the merrier for mine.
Peteb: Speaking of the greatful dead and once mutually accommodating blog sites, I hear that BF’s team leader ‘deni’ now blames John Wayne Gacy for her fear of clowns…I blame visions of deni’s signature pic for mine. The BF Beaumont punters seem to be lost for words now that things beyond their scope of comprehension have come to light like a blast of fresh air through a London metro dunny.
It might be appropriate to mention that, in two memorials placed by friends of John & Dot Snoswell in the Centralian Advocate’s Weekly Times (2014 & 2017), a score or more of family members are mentioned including direct recent lineage ie. John’s brother Bronte (dec.) and sister Jean along with Dot’s sister Noreen (dec.), plus grand children a plenty. Strangely no nieces or nephews are listed in the mix like the three children of Bronte & wife Joan born 1951, 1952 and 1954, none of whom can be traced, likewise Joan Estelle doesn’t get a mention even though she died as a Snoswell in 2007 at Glenelg, seventeen years after her husband. One other who missed the cut was Jean’s husband Max, the no name pair having married in ’47 and conveniently disappeared.
Hell hath no fury like a lover (woman) scorned. Fom William Congreve’s The Mourning Bride (1697), which @anquer over BigFooty way has astutely presented for consideration. Maybe slightly misquoted but not to be misjudged nonetheless, in it’s intent or meaning and about bloody time too.
Everything is shut up tight as a drum following my Beaumont Kids alive and well dsuggestion. Early responders to my posts here, picked up by the one dedicated blog to which I don’t contribute, went from mildly interested to apprehensive, to skeptical then to rudely dismissive. Breaking down barriers of the historically popular alternate list of blond haired surfer type child slayer suspects put forward from the very beginning must remain untenable for the immediate present. Two attempts to bring police up to date through S.A. Crime Stoppers web page, most recently for attention Superintendent Des Bray, (SM shovel man) have not been responded to. So one last plea for sensibility to Safcol’s head honcho and a call to reason, hard ball being the only option, such as dealing directly with Jim and the kids to secure a long overdue outcome..
As for now deceased parents of four, John and Dot Snoswell, all of which were born between ’56 and ’61 with Richard John ’57, the only one registered; John was a well known sportsman from the thirties through to his marriage to Dot Hams in 1955. Apart from his tennis and athletics ability he excelled in Australian Rules Football, playing as half back and centre half forward in rural S.A., positions that require greater than average reach, agility, with of course abilty to mark and kick long distances. Goes without saying men with these credentials are more often on the tall side and as John’s dad Cleveland was five eleven in WW1, we can seek a little genetic arvancement licence and give him an inch or two on that. We’re not to know as yet much about physical appearance of the couple, though I suspect Dot of being average height or mire, her dad Eric having been nearly 5′ 9″ on his WW2 record…Reason for bringing this up be purely promotion of what I’m almost sure to be an elementary observation of fact. It is all based on the disclosure that the couple’s younger son David Grant, who is well know to me by now from facebook pics, happens to have none of the physical attributes accredited to his late father. In fact Dave’s physical presentation even in late middle age would tend to be more similar to (Jim) Grant Beaumont Snr. ie. short, nuggety and bald as a badger, his comparative height being about the same at 5′ 6″ thereabouts. This disclosure will undoubtedly be ridiculed by many, nonetgeless I’ll go further and offer that the man’s cherubic facial features overall are uncanily similar to those of a four year old Grant Beaumont Jnr. as presented in news pics of him in 1966.
We can assume that Bronte Snoswell’s fiance’s Nancy Beaumont and Joan Lynas knew of each other at least, the respective engagements being announced only nine months appart in ’47 & ’48, so who can tell if hostility ensued. Joan was a nursing sister in Adelaide’s Dawes Park repat. hospital and we might envisage that Bronte (ex RAAF) met her whilst a patient there. She was from a large old Victorian grazing family with wartime military credentials, including her dad Arthur a WW1 Military Medal winner and her cousin Major Una Florence Lynas who was with BCOF in Kure Japan (like Jim Beaumont and Monica McMahon). Joan Estelle did marry Bronte, the couple begat thrice and sermed to move between rural land holdings they farmed, while still calling Glenelg home. He was living at Christies Beach when he passed in 1990, while she was at her in-laws home in Glengowrie when she followed in 2007. Joan along with John and Bronte Snoswell plus John’s wife Dorothy and possibly a mysterious middle sister Jean Gladys who martied Max somebody in 1946, so happen to be my only people of interest re the maybe not so missing Beaumont kids.
I’m sure I mentioned elswhere the wrongly captioned (by police?) photograph of Nancy Beaumont with her kids and a tall man and woman standing at front of a caravan, cameraman being breadwinner Jim no doubt. I’ts worth considering that the unidentified couple are of the right age group and general bearing to be one with my persons of interest, the Lucern croppers of Ngarkat John and Dot. The instamatic Kodak 126 b/w snap gives a darker hair aspect than natural, so in this regard I’m thinking that the man seen with the kids at Glenelg on 26/1/66 ie., Six feet one inch tall, with spare athletic build and light brown hair (nit blond), could pass for the man in our pic., who could in turn be the same John Snoswell, though I’m not that far along to affirm.
Best guess from my stated perspective is that the Snoswell caravan’s location was likely a standing site (shrub by the door) on The Coorong estuary an hour south of Coombe where the Tintinarar/Keith farmers had their permanent weekenders for boating and fishing. A closer view of the Millard van reveals a grounded fishing launch with raised spar off to the left of the picture so it would also have been a perfect destination for the Beaumont kids, this as opposed to the desolate Ngarkat farm setting. My take is that young Richard Snoswell would likely have stayed home with granmpa Hams to take care of the stock, hence his not being in the frame.
It had also been reported in Sydney tabloids that a recently retired ace detective Ray Kelly had gone to Adelaide on assignment to The Sun in March ’66 to see what he could do to help solve the case. He only stayed two days and covered as much as he was able, but couldn’t manage a much desired interview with the missing children’s parents Jim and Nancy Beaumont. They were not available, having gone off to an unknown secluded destination 100 miles distant to find solace in their grief. Turns out that the road distance to central Coorong (see above is 183 Kms. in today’s money or precisely 100 miles by my best conversion estimation. I’m not making this up. NB my previous posts give other known Snoswell hotspots such as Tintiarra and Curramulka being of a similar distance.
With a little careful scanning Google maps and aerial aspects of The Coorong, I’m quite satisfied that the Beaumont family Caravan pic was shot with the morning sun behind looking towards a westerly panoramic aspect. Progressive viewing in that general direction from the objective lens gives glimpse of a beached craft and tree lined bay in the distance. This is very clear on a scaled larger map and includes a narrow rock outcropping further along, itself being part of an ancient land spit which now forms two small islands near Woods Well camp site. There’s a service line pole aligned with the wooden craft in the mid distance which suggests that the caravan van is parked off the main road in from Tininara and Ngarkat.
Looking through various Beaumont photo collections, there is another van shot with Jim and the kids from a similar aspect which is not so clear, then another taken at another time in the afternoon from a northerly vantage with the van’s tail light in the frame. This one is of mother and children only and it might have been snapped on a different day or even on another outing altogether. From further search through photos it has come to my attention that the family owned a small station wagon, possibly Japanese. Back in the 60s Hillman and Isuzu partnered to produce their nippy Minx/Bellet estate hatch. Not enough grunt to pull an eighteen foot Millard but, as stated earlier I think the van site belonged to the Snoswells. static.
I’ve just had advice from the S.A. AG’s office re my Beaumont Kids case outline for personal attention of Hon. Vickie Chapman MP. Response was but a few polite words of receipt from her office, in essence thanking me for my input on the ‘1996’ [sic] Beaumont Children Abduction case..It was headed Official and signed Yours sincerely…… Is that the answer that one should expect, after 45 years of tireless work and resulting notification that a resolution to one of modern history’s most enduring unsolved crimes might now be at hand…There goes my reward, but to be fair, it was on offer for solving murders with no mention of a happy ending; man should have read the fine print before embarking on such a cause.
7 Winston Crescent Glengowrie, 15 Kipling St. Glengowrie and 109 Harding St. Glengowrie were addresses connected to the Snoswell family, Tom Patterson PMG postman and the Beaumonts in 1966, all of them fairly closeby and east of the Diagonal rd. Somerton Park divide according to my Glenelg map. Cleveland’s son Bronte was at 6 Goldsworty Cres. Nth Glenelg and Cleve’s brother-in-law, a retired grazier had apparently moved into the pre ’56 large old home at 4/6 Chapel Street.
I only wish that some earlier punter had put to-gether a pin map locater in order to give those interested some idea of the general prospective crime scene layout. Far too late now but we’ve got it sussed out the hard way by going at it by separating likely from likely not scenarios.
Then there was Jim’s younger rudder Maxwell John Beaumont who seems to have been a sexual deviant of some note in his teens. Whether Nancy had any cause to distrust him around the little women in her house we’re not to know, though he was accused of being complicit in the abductions, according to press reports in the seventies. Anyhow we’ll stay within the spirit of fairness and leave his conduct in later life for others to discuss. Merely noting that in 1966 he was living at 14 Elm Grove, Oaklands Park barely a mile from his bro’s spread down the other end of diagonal Rd. I’m still sorting out the Snoswell link to A. Anderson, grazier of 4/8 Chapel Rd. (last post), the name being rather too abundant by genealogical trap searching terms.
So you think that the guy she was engaged to 8 years before he first got married ended up adopting her children? And the woman he actually married went along with it? Even though none of their real children’s birth dates match with the Beaumont children’s birth dates?
It’s a bit confusing.
Misca nada: No; I don’t think anything of the kind. Your misinterpretation of facts in the Beaumont case is telling. Somehow reminiscent of errors pointed out with your Jessica Harkness misadventure a while back and ending in total loss of face no?
I saw you coming a mile off friend, saw through your ruse and so was anticipating this visit with some relish. I’m pleased to reply if you have any serious questions wanting clarification re this case study, but please endeavour to make sensible discourse if at all possible.
What ruse?
Ruse is the same in Frog but with an accent. Got it now?
Apparently after seeing the kids off to the beach on the day, Nancy paid visit to a female aquaintance living close by her home. This became a topic of interest as to who the friend was and why she was never called upon to give her recollections of stated chain of events apropos time factor inconsistencies. I’m not absolutely certain at this juncture, however it seems likely from a process of elimination that a childless? couple Bryce and Noreen Ashenden lived just a five minute walk from the Beaumonts in Johnstone street, Glengowrie, lady of the house being the sister of John Snoswell’s wife Dorothy. The couple were still domiciled there in 1973 and no changes are recorded for nearby family members Bronte, wife Joan, father Cleveland and his wife Gladys. Max Beaumont was still at the same Oaklands Park address with a second unamed spouse. Jim (Grant) and Nancy are listed as living at the same 109 Harding Street address as is A.M. Anderson at 6 Chapel Street, Glenelg, the old Snoswell place near to where the kids were last officially reported.
My feeling is that now S.A. A/G Vicki Chapman and Sapol Cold Case man Des Bray are on top of their Somerton Man initiative, don’t be surprised if they now get to work on my recent surprise disclosures apropos an even more mysterious case from Somerton ie., the assumed but never substantiated 1966 Beaumont children abductions. My recent attempts to correspond with both our bigwigs abovenamed has resulted in a single cursory form reply from Vicki and nothing from Supt. Bray or his immediate subordinate from 2020. I also feel that something must be in the wind at the Big Footy dedicated Beaumont site with it’s bevy of sexual deviant thrill kill usual suspect supporters. For many years years that blog’s faithful followers have been obsessively prolific, right up until some details of my contrary views and inquiries were revealed to them here and elswhere. But for a single difficult to diseminate comment of 14th April, nought has appeared for maybe two months which is totally out of character for that disagreeable mob. Just in the past day or so a similar though more respectfully (overly imo) moderated Glenelg based blog has taken down it’s Beaumont segment completly including all my posts. Thank Goodness my lack of trust in the site master led me to retrieve them all, dating back a year or so and which outline my direct contributing case involvement from 1974/75. Old detective instincts tell me that something is afoot and about to break and if anyone be an odds punter, they can bet London to a Brick on Safcol making a Beaumont/Snoswell connection.
There can only be one logical reason for two dedicated Beaumont blogs going suddenly quiet in one case and, closing down it’s site and deleting two years of comment with no prior warning in t’other. It seems more logical than others considered, though quite unethical in it’s intent and ramifications if true. I’m suggesting orders coming from an authority claiming cencorship rights over blogs that allow unfettered online posts critical of perceived police incompetence. This of course would seem as a consequence of my related comments with respect to my own lengthy inquiries that goes against the grain of an historic unsolved murder investigation that is flawed. Namely in that there was no abduction or murder in the manner oft reported and that in fact the alleged victims, three children named Jane, Arnna and Grant Beaumont be most likely now living under the very noses of SAFCOL [sick] cold case detectives.
John – I have chased a couple of potentials for Jessica Harkness but when I found that they were dead ends, I myself came out and said so…I’m not sure what you’re implying but generally, I like facts and whenever I can, I state them.
That aside, I’m still not sure I understand your implications here regarding the Beaumont’s. So, you’re not suggesting that it was Nancy’s ex-fiance (Bronte Snoswell) that may have “adopted” the children but instead, his brother John Cleveland Snoswell? And that he and his wife Dorothy May might have raised them as their own?
Misca: That would be a reasonable synopsis of my strongly felt contentions, but simplified to the extent that whilst most like you have meat on the bone, you’ve no doubt missed all importaht connecting tissue, or to put it bluntly the guts of the matter. Unfortunately much of my recent case notes posted over the past year or so on a dedicated Beaumont site have been deleted along with all evidence of the blog’s existence. My advice, if you’re really interested in my un unpopular theory, borne of similar alternate views held by a ‘thinking’ man’s case detective that I had debriefed many years ago on related issues, then try perusing what I have posted on this threae. I don’t promise that my information on the subject will fill you with admiration for my initiatives, but that is all I can offer.
Reading your rants on here I have no doubt that you are probably banned from BF Johnny..
The allegations you have made here are outstanding, and ridiculous at the same time. My greatest wish right now is that Mr. Beaumont doesn’t have to read your fiction!!
You are something and nothing, your story would make a great fiction book, heck, i’d read it…Maybe they can make it into a midday movie for bored housewives to watch..
Reading between the lines on here it seems to me that you have bullied people, although disguising it as “i’m right and the rest are wrong”.
Your story leads no where, there were few and far between points you’ve made that make any sense.
Nick: BF Beaumont is back on line with some idle chatter on Max McIntyre, Munro and their usual suspects. Some harmless naysaying directed my way plus a little critique directed to you for supporting a bunch of stupid theories, from Deni who is a BF consultant. My regrets to him/her/it also for it seems I errantly refered to him? As ‘leader’ instead of ‘senior’ (like GC), a superior rank within it’s structure no doubt. I also note that at my discreet suggestion, Deni has swapped her? scary on line post image to that of a cat which is more pleasing by far.
Deni: Surprise Surprise, the gal from Denillequin no doubt and so a real country bumkin what? Just like the gruff ‘BUMPKIN’ that we all had so much respect for re knowledge of matters DNA aye. You seem happy enough now to speak of things other than the SM exhumation with which you have entertained us to tears for so many years. Nice to have you swing by old thing…sort of!
I’m neither a leader nor a senior at the BF forum, oh, I forgot, I only have senior under my name because ivé made a certain amount of posts, i’m just a regular member over there. Don’t believe me? Then ask one or more of their Admin!!
I don’t know where you get me being ‘involved’ with the Somerton Man, I know nothing about his demise and subsequent exhumation, only what ivé read online, so you have the wrong woman there mate..
You really need to do some decent research before you start accusing people of things they know nothing about..
And lastly, is that quip about Deni from Denillequin just your attempt at humour, or do you really think that because you jump from one topic to another trying to make yourself look like you know more than you do, which is pretty much zero on the posts you’ve made.
I’m wondering why people humour you and your stories, ivé had messages from members here that are also members at BF telling me to ignore you and your fictional posts, over the last few days..
How many fake accounts do you have now, I have two accounts, one in Deni Tomkinson, my married and middle name, which is completely legal, and one in Dawn Hancock, which is my maiden name and first name, and again, it’s legal.
I wrote that just in case you were to post that I have fake accounts, neither are fake and if i’m asked I give total disclosure to anyone!!
So tell me yours, at a guess I would say Prof. Derek Abbott..
As hard as Ivé tried I just cannot get through all of your posts Johnny.
But I will correct some things as I go along in the next week or more..
The childrens bus stop was directly outside of Wenzels, it dropped them off there, and would have picked them up at the same spot!!
Deni: Guess you’re addressing me; if so allow me the pleasure of responding to your two questions on which I’m happy to oblige…re the Deni for Deniliquin ‘quip’ that you seem to have taken graven offence to, I’m sorry you would think that; my old army mates from the region were ‘mostly’ refered to affectionately as Deni’s unlike the Dubbo’s from Dubbo and Bogans from Bogan Gate. In respect of my so called ‘fake’ accounts, you do me an undeserved honour to suggest that I’m at any level of competence with such technology to go beyond one 4 x 5 inch agricultural device which is probably one too many. Another of your fellow BF ‘Seniors made a similar, though most accusory like claim, revealing on line that I had twenty IPs by last count and made good use of them for my universal ‘dark web’ activities that included pedophile exchange &c. which he is yet to be confronted formally. I have one and one only by my last reckoning and whatsmore I’m not ashamed to use my God given name when on line or in any other capacity. Mate, I can’t help you with a maiden name as my Pacific Island atu monicker is not for disclosure, but if you find need of an otherwise detailed personal dosier including army and later police service, @Way-Out-West attended to that on this great friendly site in 2017. You’ll find it rather boring which is moi in a nutshell I guess. Good luck to you Deni and don’t be fearful of what tomorrow may have in store as Jesus our Saviour is out there to guide us through the darkness in our never ending struggles for a better understanding and pluck to achieve our earthly aims.
Classic Sanders. A piece to be savoured: like an oyster, taken whole and gently squeezed against the pallet until all the delightful flesh slides throatwise downwards.
Memories of the old Hawksbury river farm snotties from Moonie over the bridge on the old highway. Shelled and drunk from the bottle like a fine railway port, plus a couple of battered lizard fillets (flathead) and a bobs wortha chips with vinegar and a ton of salt. Couldn’t get better nosh east of Port Said. Ask DR, he’ll remember them days of yore for sure.
JS is DA? That’s got to be one of the craziest SM theories yet…..and there’s some cuckoo ones out there….
(pedantic) Re Wenzel’s (corner of Jetty and Moseley) I’m pretty sure the bus stop would have been in Moseley St (around #10). So it wouldn’t have *quite* been “just out the front” (buses don’t stop on corners). Most services would start/terminate there (and then up High St and back onto Jetty Rd/Anzac Highway via Partridge (or back to wherever their route came from).
Deni: In re your last on Wenzels, mine of 15/12/20 should cover your current need to overview and correct my far from perfect subject knowledge and therefore zero contribution. Your greater expertise and time spent running potential culprets to earth is a given and a woman’s touch, even one of some seniority is always handy. So give it your best with my blessing and get back soonest with some critique on my host of fictional posts.
Maybe it was Col Snoswell with a candlestick?
Marco Margaritoff is a Brooklyn based freelance writer. His latest feature article for wiki media’s all thats Interesting dated May 17 & 25 is well written but no more enlightening than a thousand others of similar content in a half century plus. With the excepion for it’s rather more thought provoking conclusion which I found most telling. It’s not likely to change opinion of those who lust for morbid outcomes or have their hopes for finality set on pre existing views based on the evidence given by sadly torured minds, be that as it may…Read on thus;
The Beaumont Children’s disappearance remains the longest running missing persons case in Australian history. Books, TV movies and true crime podcasts continue to explore the case, but the sad truth might be that the Beaumont children are long dead, still captive or, LIVING FREELY IN PURPOSEFUL ANONYMITY..
Oh yeah. A window table at the old Mooney Mooney RSL eating ersters and watching the Moxham family clearing their trays on the Hawkesbury River, drinking cold beer and waiting for South’s to rip Manly to pieces, wondering if Prosper Thommo is the giver of the DNA Robin satisfactorily passed it on to his daughter.
It’s true what they say about taking your time eating a few dozen oysters, the mind becomes a little more receptive.
milongal: Does that mean I get to share Derek’s Missus, salary, fringe benefits and a Mr. Somerton portrait in my kitchen…About the bus stop, I won’t have to repeat ref. my post of 15 December last, we actually discussed the bus stop on the breezeway entrance between 4 and 6B Moseley running through to 4 Milton, thence 100 yds further to the 4/6 Chapel St. T intersection.
A great old Glenelg racing man’s axiom that has stood the test of time is ‘Horses for Courses’ which is true of the local Morphetville race track. Apply that reasoning to early stages of the Beaumont case and the only horse in that race insomuch as suspects go was a fellow seen playing with the later missing kids near the beach pavillion area. A man described by two reliable eye witnesses as being 6 feet tall, mid to late thirties, clean cut countenance with longish fair to brown hair hair and an athletic build. In the years since, we’ve had many named suspects offered up for selection, none of whom ever came close in form or phys to fitting the bill for the chap in blue out of fashion togs. They being typically too old too young, too blond or too damned guilty looking, that is bar one, a former top athlete named John Cleveland Snoswell aged 37, who was born and raised two hundred yards from where the kids were last seen and who must have know every nook and cranny of Glenelg’s back street environs. Not by any stretch the be all and end all to my assertions, for the pathway leading to him along with his co conspatorial kith and kin only got better as I followed numerous unwavering leads to the secluded farm on Snoswell Road, Coombe in the Ngarket mallee wilderness where three undocumented kiddies named Jill, Helen and David Grant were raised in a loving family to adulthood. Anyone with sensible questions, please be my guest.
Well, it’s such a strange case, I guess it’s within the realm of possibility. I guess the question I would have is why? And why the Snoswell’s specifically?
Snoswells as a family of interest in the case came about through the brilliance of a most intuitive, streetwise and totally misunderstood and oft ridiculed self taught street detective Stanley ‘Killer’ Swaine, who dared to think outside the square and put forward questions like “why mucking not”?….He told me things that resonated long after he died a forlorn defeated old man in his failed quest for resolution of his two unsolved and in his view, unrelated missing children cases, Beaumont ’66 and Adelaide Oval seven years later.
As a bit of a breather from my unchained melody ad nausium I’ve been going through old notes on the original key Glenelg players namely a forgetful postie Tom Patterson, first attender Det. Mostyn Matters, the Wenzel’s girl and a couple more of interest. Brought to mind all the talk, mostly recent and on line about Harry Satin Man Phipps, a middle aged local businessman who was said to hand out one pound notes willy nilly, which got author Mullins started on his second best selling book on his own clearly guilty suspect for the abductions and murder. Couldn’t help thinking that poor Harry’s (Fred Henry) ghost isn’t likrly to win any support for his innocense with a bloke like Stuart Mullins on his case. My own take is that we have her a local Glenelg boy born and bred who must be known by sight around the town to many. He’s then able to pick up three little kids unrecognised from a bussling and highly visible location, then fifty years on he’s suddenly the main target of suspicion and what’s more the poor feller’s too long gone to protest his innocence. I wasn’t a beach kid growing up in the fifties, but I do recall finding the odd green paper pound note or two when going into town every so often to attend events where crowds gathered, similar to Glenelg Beach on Australia day 1966 one might imagine…No critisim but Jeez old Stuey must be one helluva good and convincing writer.
Just a hunch, though very well hatched. I’ve been trying to locate Cleveland Snoswells third child Jean without luck for a year or more, believing she could well have played a role with brothers Bronte and John in arranging transfers and like temporary housing for three kiddies. Just found her along Diagonal Rd. on the bus route to Glenelg, one stop north of Harding St., nice old rendered cottage on a cnr. block with a weird high wall brick fence all the way round which may be post ’66. This had been Jean’s in-laws place from 1943 which she, hubby and kids? must have aquired on their later passing; it’s where they were living in 1966 which is most convenient. Husband Max died in ’87 and Jean it seems was still with us as late as 2017, for all we know she hasn’t moved and keeping house yet at age 95. Others might not agree but If I was a plodder like Spt. Bray, I’d be on my way out to Glengowrie for a cuppa and a chat with the old dear about this and that. Though I doubt that these days Des goes too far without the channel 9 cameras and a NC memorised press statement in his Armani jacket’s breast pocket.
Jean Snoswell’s father in law Tom Langley, a twice wounded amputee from WW1 passed in ’66 and we find his widow Doris Ethel living a little further north towards Jetty Rd. on Brighton Rd. Before the war her husband Max was a trainee jeweller, though after demobilisation from the navy in ’46, we don’t have him up anywhere. I think that is probably as far as we need to take that particular line at this stage, though be advised that another Max T. Langley from no relative, had been living in Durham Street Glenelg.
Gladys Emily Louise nee Wescombe wife of Cleveland Frank Snoswell, a Glenelg realtor, was 73 years old in 1966. This is the same stated age as a woman who had come forward to tell police about a man she saw playing on a grassed area with three kids, near to where she was sitting with her grandaughter. From memory she was later approached by the man enquiring about money ‘pinched’ from the kids? clothing and so was able to give cops a good description. We can only wonder if she might not have been old Gladys S. and an integral part of the planned kid’s abduction plot. In which case no wonder they seemed to be at ease with the man (from other witnesses) and her testimony would have been concocted. I’m not a devout supporter of this due to certain factors such as the old dear’s description of the St. Peter’s school old style blue/white swimmers that would fit with my very own candidate but the scenario cannot be discounted out of hand.
….It so happens that the elderly eye witness who so far as I’m aware was never named, even by the press, was never heard from again which is notable as with her 12 year old grand daughter who was also witness to the kiddies frolliking with the suspect nearby. One might have thought she would have cime foward years later to tell her version of what transpired to which she was witness. It’s worth adding that my family of interest’s 73 year old matriarch Gladys who passed in 1981, was also the grangmother of Cleveland Snoswell’s 12 year old daughter.
You said this Johnny:
“Everything is shut up tight as a drum following my Beaumont Kids alive and well dsuggestion. Early responders to my posts here, picked up by the one dedicated blog to which I don’t contribute, went from mildly interested to apprehensive, to skeptical then to rudely dismissive”
Nothing could be further from the truth, we’ve just taken it to private messages so the likes of you will go away, so don’t think for a minute that it was your fairy tale that shut us up!
And milongal you said this:
“Re Wenzel’s (corner of Jetty and Moseley) I’m pretty sure the bus stop would have been in Moseley St (around #10). So it wouldn’t have *quite* been “just out the front” (buses don’t stop on corners). Most services would start/terminate there (and then up High St and back onto Jetty Rd/Anzac Highway via Partridge (or back to wherever their route came from).”
I never once mentioned that Wenzels was on the corner, they were further up. Look up on Google maps for the Terrace housing on Mosley street, they are on the opposite side to Wenzels, directly across. My family lived in one of the lower
ones , one of my older brothers and I used to catch the bus from there to the city, unless we took the tram!
I’m not surpised you’re a God botherer Johnny, you write fiction and read fiction..
Do you pray to your God for forgivness when you post something rude about someone, isn’t that a sin lol
Deni: I’m not surprised that a sweetheart like your good self would have no repect for the truism that Goodness might triumph against evil and lack of faith. But I’m not terribly surprised in your immodest claim on facebook to the following rant….”I have a sick sense of humour that offends some people and if you don’t like it, don’t friend me”. I hope that the Good Lord might be inclined to love you just the same. I’ll therefore be praying most fervently for your salvation girl whether you like it or not. PS. If you and your like naysayers have gone to private messaging, I must be on the money what?
In re Jean Langley, named by me as being a person of interest to the Beaumont brief; it’s come to my attention that a person of the same name and year of birth 1925, has been mentioned over at Big Footy blog in connection with their Tamam Shud deal. This occurrence can be deemed coincidence as neither is connected to the other in any manner or form.
Milongal: Of course you’re spot on re Wenzel’s being cnr. Jetty & Moseley at No. 2 and as per my earlier advice, the Milton St access laneway goes through to the just lately (1965) unoccupied home at No. 4 Milton. The South bound bus stop was then located right between 2D (Ryan’s Myer store) & 2D (Mrs. B.W. Day) Moseley perhaps a chain or so from tge corner. Sure enough three then modern blocks of flats were directly opposite as the good lady attests; so one point to each of us, you the bus driver, me the conductor and Deni our delightful dubutant Godsend so well done we three.
In relationship to the above, it will do no harm to repeat that a woman who came forward months after the event, spoke of seeing three young kiddies two girls snd a boy following a man down a laneway (initial M) and into a vacant house etc., etc. Nora and Harry Mendelson had occupied 4 Milton St. (laneway entrance), she passing in July ’65 and he nine months earlier. Their house became vacant and was still so in January 1966, all pure coincidence no doubt and nothing at all to do with this case of sad neglect and incompetence.
Johnny: Wenzels was not on the corner of Jetty and Mosley street, it was slightly further down, not by a lot though.
Like I said before, go to Google maps and look up the original Wenzels then swing around 180 and you’ll see the terrace housing that I lived in, they were directly across the road. On the right of them, as you’re facing that way, is a laneway for people to park their cars out the back if they are staying there. If memory serves they are now a backpackers hostel!
For a very long time the McIntyers have been saying that their father, Max McIntyer, murdered the Somerton man. So why all this cloak and dagger from Xlamb, aka, Kate, aka Ruth collins, nee McIntyer and siblings I wonder!!
Deni: I’ve done all the homework on positioning and in my view the only object likely to be standing between Wenzel’s at 2 Moseley and it’s intersection with Jetty Rd. curbside on Australia Day 1966 would have been a sign post pointing towards the bus stop. It in turn abutted Milton laneway between the two 2D Moseley Street addresses as I’m sure to have pointed out ad nausium….As for Ruth, yes she has been a regular contributor on the Tamam Shud case for years and we’ve become quite used to her well meaning though self serving idiosyncractic carryings on about Max McIntyre. God bless her.
I know where the bus stop was, I lived there at that time, I lived at 1-7 Moseley as these pictures show, our place was the first ground floor unit.
And while i’m here, you seem to know a lot about me, ie: my sick sense of humour.
How about you stalk someone else, what would make you feel the need to find that out about me a splash it in here, it has nothing to do with this forum!!
The mind does boggle, somewhat!
Deni: You posted about your style of humour on Facebook under Tomkinson I think; along with employment data and pic. Besides old habits die hard for ex suits, still tracking down bad guys or else needing to know about potential allies and foe alike. From about April or May 1967 to mid December, then from October ’68 to March ’69 I was inclined to visit Glenelg beach on weekend leave from Woodside camp. I can recall getting off the bus on your side of Moseley Street, then crossing to buy a pastie and a pineapple doughnut or similar at Wenzels for lunch, before heading down to Pier Hotel for a snort or three with me mates….had some good times in Adelaide and some not so….. Even though Jesus surely loves us all equally, there must be times when some of God’s unruly children test even His resolve.
That is what I was talking about, you hunting me down on Facebook, why would you even want to do that.
You say “old habits die hard for ex suits, still tracking down bad guys or else needing to know about potential allies and foe alike”
Do you seriously think i’m a bad guy/woman?
You must do if you plaster it on here for all to see. Trolling comes to mind here!!
In your case Deni, I’d like to think that ‘allies’ fits the scenario rather than foe, or bad guys. Nevertheless I feel your pain girl, so henceforth I’ll be working on changing my evil ways. I hope that you’ll now join with me in asking the Almighty for this to be so………………….Amen
As a further little sweetener for Dear Deni, I’d ask any like minded good Christians within our harmonious little collective to visit her facebook page Deni Tomkinson; Then read her latest pure hearted comments and if you see fit, ask nicely to be her friend. Hallelujah.
Geez Nick. I can’t believe you let these kind of shit comments through. Doxing as well as shaming one’s beliefs. Disgusting. Are you actually JS (passive aggressive to boot) or are the clicks that important to you?
misca: anyone who even thinks for a microsecond that I spend years toiling away at posting on unbelievably obscure aspects of unbelievably obscure cipher mysteries for *clicks* needs their head examined. If I wanted clicks, you’d be reading “PuppaFrenz.com” right now, or something no less ghastly.
And as for whether John Sanders is somehow the Emu to my Rod Hull? No. Just no. Still no. No.
No.
Deni & misca: Feminine flavoured Savoir faire must take the voir vie en rose prize for teamwork, with His blessing no doubt. And so I remain just another Godless digger in the wood pile manly ineptness.
If you would like to speak at me, or to me in the future, go do it on my FaceBook page, you clearly know where it is and you don’t need to be a friend to message someone.
Just leave it out of here, your sarcastic, misogynistic words just show what type of person you are!!
I won’t be replying to your silly remarks in here again, unless it’s to do with the topic of conversation!!
Sorry to Nick for keeping the ridiculous narrative going..
A minor update to Grant’s situation is that he has advised a fed. agency change of domicile and business (propery advisory) address for service, from Prospect to an elite Adelaide CBD fringe satelite suburb. No changes are apparent for his older sisters Jane (Loxton S.A.) and Arnna (Nuriootpa S.A.) though that cannot be guaranteed unless Det. Supt. Des Bray is prepared to follow through on my advices from way back in December ’20. I note that a Snoswell family trust, set up around 2000 has it’s address for notification in the Adelaide Hills (see J.M. Snoswell hist.) near to where the kid’s brother? Richard Snoswell now runs his own real estate venture.
My Mother In Law’s Great Great Grandparents were Sarah Berryman and William Grant Newport Beaumont and there is a daughter of them missing from your tree. She was Esther Hellen Beaumont b1884 d1969. She was born between Alice and William Samuel Grant Beaumont.
Cheers Catherine Stone
Catherine: I note that one index lists Esther’s interrment in ’69 at Centenial Park with surname Devereaux, possibly married to John or Matthew but, on the S.A. Genealogy the poor dear only gets a mention for having had a ‘deceased estate’. Can’t find fault with your inhouse information, including brothers William (Jim’s dad) and Arthur who lived in Glenelg before retiring OS apparently.
I see what went wrong, on the Beaumont tree, Sydney Newport jr. landed in the spot between Alice & William, thereby taking Esthers rightful place based on her 1884 birthright. Syd the sometime troublesome brother did not arrive until 1889 so perhaps things might now be put in order for sake of posterity.
For whatever, it must be said that, despite the Beaumonts being seen as God fearing Methodists, not a single male member of those listed in the family tree could claim to have led trouble free lives. Both Arthur (Bert) and Sidney Newport were known to have had arrest warrants chasing them pre WW2. William Grant, nephew Maxwell as well as Bert had convictions connected with booze, Alfred Edward was RTA’d from Suez in 1915 with a self inflicted ‘wound’ and of course Jim (Grant) was awarded amongst lesser penalties for AWL, an incredulous one month prison sentence in 1946 whilst serving with BCOF in Japan. It does need to be said that each of the four who went to war, served in frontline infantry units and all are
recorded as having been wounded in action.
johnymac 1 (Team Leader): As for your melodramatic passionate outpouring over Big Footy way, vis. Jimmy Little and the villainous Uncle Tom; As someone who should know, let me assure you that your main character Jimmy, a Yorta Yorta man, is sadly no longer with us and therefore might be forgiven his complacency to come forward. As for the evil personage Uncle Tom, I heard he had drowned in his own guilt or as some insist, burned to a cinder in his fire trap log cabin. Either way the old dark menace be no longer answerable to any claimed past anti social behaviour. Cheers JS
Harking back to my 6th June post on Jean Snoswells’s husband Max Langley the jeweller.Turns out I had him mixed with another Max Langley also from Somerton, the gaff no doubt due to earlier distraction by two of old gals of my unfortunate aquaintance. Anyhow Jean’s man worked in insurance and in 1966 the couple lived at 56 Diagonal Rd., just two hundred metres north of the Beaumont children’s abode at 109 Harding Street. I managed to trace Max Thomas Langley to his final rest site, but nothing similar with his good lady and it would not surprise to find her still out and about at age 95, perhaps with some worries to offload before her atonement call.
Why would people on big footy be talking about SM still? Surely the Dees are more newsworthy!
milongal: and particularly the moderator who seems to be away with the fairies.
…..take that back, Kurv the BFTS mod. has been vaxxed for weeks now in response to Redacted Tapatalk’s plea to all punters to do likewise. Got my first shot of the new Korean Fizzer? single dose a while back and apart from a runny nose, feeling great. Certainly hasn’t adversely dulled my enthusiasm for a speedy Somerton Man resolution.
Things are getting back on track with kurve’s team despite Deni’s demotion to the facebook seconds. Some award winning Big Tootie star has come to the sobering realisation that it was her gramps snatched the kids; news of which is sure to put the heat on Kate Thomson to come clean about her dad’s movements on that date back in ’66. Speaking of which (date not Kate), one better known elderly witness who came forward early, was a 74 year old Glenelg Gran who saw three kiddies playing with a man at Colley reserve. It now seems (conveniently) that an updated photofit revels a perfect likeness to then 54 year old Prosper Thomson whom we recall became lynch pin to the famous Glenelge/Somerton love triangle, espionage murder case scenario. Don’t know how it would go down in the Leahy household down along the Murray, but heck Katherine’s dad has been the prime suspect in many a cold case almost from the cradle to the grave , so she’ll take stock and add to to her for sale inventory…..What’s more likely to be of interest to my followers, the malgne few; getting back to our unamed elderly witness. It comes to mind that Gladys Emily Wescomb was the wife of Cleveland Snoswell and begat Bronte and Jean of Glenelg, plus young John, a 37 year old lucerne farmer from Ngarcat. The mother of our most probable suspects for the Beaumont kid’s uplifting was also just three months short of her 74th birthday at the time of the crime, coincidence or no, ye be the judge. Give it some thought and try to get a picture of what may yet prove to be a bigger better picture than that offered up by Sapol’s finest, God help em the plods.
Have a squiz at what they’ve done to our Prosper, given him a full all round colour coordinated make over including blond hair and age reduction treatment to fit him up for his new role as the diabolical Glenelg beach child abductor ala ’66. The Big Tootie sleuths have also extended his WW2 service career out to eight years as opposed to one year and nine months, conveniently placed him back in Moseley St., plus they’ve got him dressed in a blue RAAF uniform which fits with the child lover portrayal..
Some positive news on moves now afoot to get Sapol moving forward on certain important matters, along with the need to confirm present circumstances etc., of Beaumont siblings Jane (Jill), Arnna (Helen) and Grant (David Grant). This has come today courtessy of S. A. Police Minister Vincent Tarzia, at behest of his Attorney General Vickie Chapman, thus notifying that he has given instruction for the cold case team to expedite evaluation of my information….
If Sapol heed the latest advice on the case, as ordered by Police Minister Tarzia, first moves afoot might be directed towards interviewing the 95 year old widowed fourth generation Snoswell relic Mrs. Jean Langley. She and husband Max lived alone close to the Beaumonts in 1966 (200 yds) but moved not long after the disappearance and if still living would likely to be located at one of the many retirement homes in Somerton. There’s no doubt that she knew Nancy Beaumont and may well have been the missing childless female friend referred to in a CIB radio message logged on 29/1/66. Of course the old lady was also known as Aunt Jean to the kids as they were grewing up in the country and she is mentioned as still living, in the death notices of both John and Dorothy Snoswell a few years ago.
My 11th May post regarding the group photo and caravan can be updated and ammended in light of a more positive identification of the couple posing with Nancy and the kids in that 1965 holiday shot. Based on two newly aquired points of commonality, I think it safe to say that the pair could only be the Beaumont’s childless Somerton neighbours Maxwell Langley and Jean nee Snoswell. Said points being related to a particular distinuishing similarity twixt Max and the posing male, and to a lesser degree, Jean’s familial feature traits compared to the other woman in the caravan picture…..My own feeling is, that had the weight of such evidence been properly appreciated and tested in the few first days, the case would have been resolved without any delay as the late sadly maligned Det. Sgt. Stan Swaine always insisted.
Striking while the iron’s hot and why not, waiting for folks to see the plot. Doesn’t take a scholar to figure out subsequent events in the post 1966 abduction period. It’s certainly not unexpected that some short time later, the the Langley’s moved from their walled in fortress at 56 Diagonal Rd. where they’d been since 1950 and went missing for two years. Then in ’68 they emerged and were found to be living at nearby 38 Chopin St., Somerton, a modern bungalow where they were in ’73 when S & McD folded. So It’s likely after Max passed in ’87, Jean stayed until selling up in ’97, my guess being that in her old age she hasn’t moved too far from the scene.
Now that unsolved child historical abductions are in the news, I can share some of my own to those interested, in having at long last tracked down the ellusive Miss ‘Daphne’ Gregory who’s first name was incorrectly reported. A Miss Dorrie Gregory lived close by the ‘crime scene’ and I’m sure t’was she who nominated her ‘Ape walking’ suspect to retired Det. Ray Kelly of Sydney’s Daily Mirror. She was new to Glenelg and moved not long after to Prospect where she remained until her death in 2014 (102). If only she could have been re interviewed later surely a more helpful description might have been had, as with that given of a suspect by the still un-named elderly couple and a middle aged lady, who were first to come forward on 27/1/66..Love to get their names also, if anyone out there has knowledge or an inkling..
Nora and Harry Mendelson had lived at 4 Milton St. Glenelg until they passed in the year preceding the abductions, leaving their house, one of only two in the breezway to Moseley St. vacant.. I’m singularly of opinion that this was where the kids went following their confirmed last sighting walking from Wenzels cakes for bus stop and the trip home. Some time after the tumult and shouting had died down, a middle aged woman came forward to tell police she had seen the kids entering a vacant house in a laneway near to her own place and her story, whilst late coming to light rings true. People living at No. 6 were UK migrants and whilst Grace the lady of the house, (50 in ’66) is deceased, I’ve been fortunate in tracking down son John who was 14 at the time. I’m yet to interview him but hope to do so if he responds to my overtures. Even if it turns out that the original informant was not his mum, he may retain memories of his boyhood excitement of the famous case so close to home…Incidently yesterday I sent an update feeler to the Sapol ‘cold case’ boss begging his audience re Jean Langley nee Snoswell and her known close ties with Nancy Beaumont from ’47 to ’66, but am not overly confident of a reply.
@JS: Vaguely remember something about the Church (Our Lady of Victories) coming up before. Suppose the kids thought they were in some sort of danger (e.g. annoyed by someone on the beach who they saw again when they went to Wenzels and were afraid was following them). Depending on their upbringing (and their knowledge of the Glenelg area – which I’d assume was reasonable), might they have headed up Milton in the hope of hiding (or finding help) in the Church? A naive kid might think that if there’s “Bad Guys” around, they won’t follow them into a church – or at least wouldn’t cause trouble in there.
milongal: You’ll understand no doubt that I’m standing resosutely on the vacant house of the then recently deceased Nora Mendelson who had occupied No. 4 on the breezway exit to Milton Street. It came to me as a no brainer, being only meters from the bus stop down from Wenzel’s cake shop Cnr, Moseley St. & Jetty where last confirmed sighting was made about midday. It also accorded with what a local woman said regarding her sighting of the kids being taken to a vacant home in a laneway (not accredited by police and only reported six months later in the press). Prior to reading that disclosure, I had been all over that area mainly due to it’s nearness to my targeted, most likely unattended suspect’s owned property at 4 to 6 Chapel Street which is opposite the Catholic school/St. Mary’s church grounds and the Congretional church as well. In all honesty I can’t see how the young threesome could have made their way 150 to 200 yards down Milton St. to your suggested sanctuary without being spotted by locals and of course reported. I read that Det. Swaine mentioned something about kids buried in a suburban cemetery, but that doesn’t equate to what he told me may years before, in fact quite the opposite, though in fairness he may have been mis reported in that he was refering to the much later Adelaide Oval abductions, a case which was also offloaded to him unfortunately. It goes without saying that he was sure the Beaumont children were taken far away and resettled somewhere rural and isolated; so too their father Jim who went a step further suggesting interstate or overseas ie. NZ or USA specifically. He has maintained belief, as a dad would, that his kiddies are out there and he is still waiting hopefully close to where they lived. all thóse weary years ago. And you no what mate?, he won’t be disappounted if these idiot frigging Sapol dicks decide to take on board what I’ve been telling the fuckers the last two years.
…….PS. M of NZ as a possible re settlement, which I don’t share mind you, but which nevertheless confirms my suspect’s dad Cleveland having made two trips there, once in 1956 on RSL business and the other, more concurrently in 1965 (unspecified) of four months and one week’s duration. At that time old Cleve was residing at Glengowrie not far distant from Somerton Park; so anything is possible.
I’ll take most of the point about #4….but not sure about “…without being spotted by locals and of course reported”. There’s only 5 or so residences they have to get past, and although the street is narrow (so you might expect the slightest noise to be heard), a lot of the houses are long and narrow – so it’s possible people are in the back of the house where the noise is more insulated. And with people flocking to Glenelg for the Public Holiday, there might be a lot more ambient noise in the street that they’re drowning out too. Additionally, being a fine day and a public holiday it’s possible many of the residence were out for the day (and the tramways employee may have been working).
I’ve often wondered how much people actually notice (or recall noticing) certain people after the fact. In a similar way to SM going largely unnoticed (assuming he was in the railway station and on the bus) – it wasn’t because he was hiding, it was because people don’t notice. Granted, 3 kids probably stick out a bit more than a “normal” adult, but I suspect in similar cases a lot of “reported sightings” are a small proportions of actual sightings that people don’t recall (not to mention the high proportion of “reported sightings” that don’t relate to the incident (including for example all the mis-identifications of SM) show that people correctly reporting an actual sighting is a bit random and a lot unreliable.
Even in the Beaumont case, while they were seen at Colley Reserve and at Wenzels, there doesn’t seem to have been any sightings of them in between – despite their most direct route being through fairly busy areas. In January, Glenelg would be pumping, and the bulk of the activity would be people heading to beaches between Colley Reserve and the Jetty. I’m not saying there’s anything sus about the fact nobody noticed them, but rather that it shows how little people notice unless they think something is unusual. Perhaps three kids heading up a narrow street near Glenelg on a warm summer’s day isn’t something that sticks in your head as unusual (I notice a lot of people walk or ride up my street, but if any of them were reported as missing, the only ones I’m likely to be able to recall are the ones who I might notice as “regulars” or “locals” (e.g. some idiot on a strange sort of bike that flys through an alleyway onto the roadway several times a day) – and I’m not sure I’d even be comfortable pinpointing the day unless I was aware of it immediately).
NB: According to S&M #4 is a panel beater named Smith in the leadup to ’66 and then vacant (and later it becomes a holiday appartment)
Also S&M (remembering S&M seems to have a delay in updating information)
1965: H Mendelson 33A Penzance St (one of 3 tenants)
1966/67: Mrs NE Mendelson 33a Penzance
milongal: Nora moved to Milton St. after it was vacated by GFS following Harry’s departure in 9/64 and sadly she followed him in 7/65; the S&M reference to her at Penzance in 66/67 being obviously an oversight. Thankfully all that should concern us is that my 4 Milton St. address was infact vacant on Australia Day of 1966 which, by the way did not have public holiday status until the 90s though kids were still on their annual break from school from memory. Regarding the street situation, as can be seen even on a current Glenelg map, your place of sanctuary is further along towards the Chapel St. end. So as I’ve tried to explain, had the kids had the Church in mind, as opposed to my preferred alternative they would certainly have been observed as non residents by some locals and remembered next day when news of their disappearance broke.
Nine Network Australia viewers will be able to share tribute to Somerton man’s untimely demise just 73 years ago on this first day of summer (SH). However viewers should not expect anything even vaguely new, merely updated from similar dreary presentations in the past and not even a hint on DNA/Isotopic test progress. Not worth turning on the box for this load of codswallop, though you will in any case I’m sure.
Part of my point was observed and noticed are 2 separate things. And if it was normal for local kids to go play at the school during the holidays, then kids in Milton St might not have been unusual enough to be noticed.
The non-public holiday bit didn’t occur to me, but IMO actually works better for a notion they could have been in the street unnoticed – because some (most?) residents may have been out working rather than at home during that time.
If they come in between 4 and 6 and they have to get to 16.
I’m disimissing the Milton Court Flats – they would have been toward Jetty Rd rather than the path the kids might take (and would likely have enough of their own activity to be less aware of what is happening in the street).
#4 as you say is vacant
#6 has a salesman who might be at work
#8 is kind of apart from the main drag in it’s own culdesac
#10 appears to have 3 units – 1 is listed as a tramways employee, and if (yes, it’s only an if) that’s the front one then it makes it less likely the other residents there see some kids heading up the street (especially if they’re being relatively quiet)
#12 has a plumber
#14 has an insurance inspector
In any case it was purely a hypothetical questioning “what if” they were headed that way rather than an assertion that they must have been….
Milongal: Thanks for the input, great to have sensible feedback and good points all however, and as you’ll surely be aware, my Beaumont Investigation is way beyond potebtial contemporary street sightings of the three kids. In point of fact it is all but done & dusted, apart from a few things concerning level of involvement attribution that still need tidying up. I”m also awaiting word from Des Bray at ‘Safcol’ (not holding my breath) and also potential support from a witness for back up on a relevant issue needing clarification.
Not that it’s at all relevant but the Milton St. Mendelsons bought their rental property in Nora’s name pre war and apparently leased it to Jones then Smith up until just before the abductions. It was probably then bequeathed to their Son Max who after the period of vacancy converted it into a holiday tenancy set up. I note that Max was RAAF and served overseas as did Bronte Snoswell who hailed from up the way a hundred yards though in different squadrons from memory.
Name Max brings to mind former matelot Max Langley who married Bronte’s younger sister Jean and who appears with her and the Beamont’s sans Jim, in their ’65 Yorke Peninsular holiday caravan snapshot. Awfully peculiar in that Max Langley, taller and not balding, could be mistaken for ‘Jim’ eaumont, the likely camera man. And yet nobody ever came forward to correct this critical game changer by identifying the pair, until now. Responsibility for this failure, I’ll leave to the panel, less I be mislabelled and villified to boot. No Sir’ee
John, my family and I have just been made aware of this ridiculous thread. My father is Richard Snoswell, second child to Dot and John Snoswell. Whilst some of your historical facts are true, the most important ones are very wrong! All four of Dot and John’s children are alive and well, are very much accounted for and certainly did not ‘appear’ out of thin air!! I have seen all the photos of them together as babies and infants, they were not hidden away on a farm but were actually very well known and involved in the Keith community. There is no-one in Keith that does not know the Snoswell’s. I feel bad that you have wasted this time as you seem very invested but you have so many facts wrong. I think it may be time ro find a ne hobby or theory.
Mandy: yes I have you on my list, a sister or half sister of poor baby Rebecca from memory. I guess you havn’t been following my posts here and elswhere over the past few years. Had you, you would have perceived that I’ve never suggested the kids, your aunt’s Jill and Helen plus uncle David Grant are dead. On the contrary I’ve always put forward that they’re all alive, well and living In Keith, Nuriootpa and Norwood according to most recent checks. I’m quite sure that you would not have been made aware of what was going down with past members of the Snoswell, grandad John, great uncle Bronte and great aunt Jean who are my main people of interest re the so called abductions. If you are infact a Snoswell as you say, you might make some headway in discussing this with dad when next you’re in Strathalbyn, being mindful that he may in fact know little of his sibling’s true origins…I’ve never been in any way distrespectful in my delving into the lives of either Beaumonts or Snoswells, believe it or nay; This long investigation has been most thoroughly undertaken over 45 years and is as factually correct as can be without direct input from either family or historic police files. I’m happy to communicate further with you should you have questions or wish to provide contrary proof dispelling my assertions. Mandy, your input to date says nothing that flaws my “theory” nor any anything more than unqualified opinion of it not being valid, a little worrying coming from a claimed Snoswell family insider armed with all the pertinant fact.s
I couldn’t help but note Det. Supt. Des Bray back in fray, this time going over broad details of new/old forensic/DNA clues in the unsolved 1971 murder and dumping of Susi Schmidt 16 (Wanda murders ’65 Sharon Scmidt 16 also) in S.A.
Man seems very confident in his presentation but, seems to be working off a script and not straight up like a seasoned cold case detective might. I’ve also written to the officer at least three times regarding my connections to the Beaumont mystery and have not received any acknowledgment from him or anyone despite being assured personally by the Police Minister that my input were being dealt with at the appropriate level. About twenty years ago an old Vietnam era Army officer with no background in policing could be seen regularly at QLD police media briefings oft times in top cop regailia doing precisely what Des Bray is seen to be doing. One wonders therefore if Des is a real cold case detective or merely a pedigreed front man contracted to look the part but who couldn’t tell the difference between a felon and a fall guy. Any clues?
Peter Davidson: you might be kind enough to report if anything worthwhile turned up on your own Ellis family research, ie., Ellen Kathleen (1891/1953), Montefiore Athole (1893/1970), and son Keith (1923/89?). I’ve got him counting blankets on the homefront in WW2 then marrying Beryl in ’44 and that’s it. His dad signed up for the home guard in ’39 after serving in the ‘big one’ as well. I have him at Gallipoli in May ’15, see he was done for striking a light during a ‘stand to’ in ’17, before getting a good dose consequence of a well deserved Cairo leave just prior to his RTA in late 1918. Quite a fellow in my books and would like to know more if you scored anything. Cheers js
….and while your at it it Peter, perhaps you might also give some thought as to why, when transfering of Ellis and Beaumont family details over to Geni, that in the case of Max and Joyce Beaumont you’ve attributed to them the same death date as that of the kid’s abductions ie., Australia day 26/1/1966. We do know in the case of Max that your death date is totally wrong, however in the case of his sister I have only the year 1966 as a lead. If it turns your date is correct than more than a few interesting questions would arise I guess.
I only twigged to Peter’s interest while tidying up my case notes, realising then that I’d neglected follow-up on Jim’s mum Florence and sister Joyce. Mum Flo stayed on at the the Joslin family home after hubby William passed in ’47 and remained til 1959 (age 64) wherein Nancy became nominal householder. In the following year it changed hands when the Jim & Nancy moved into 109 Harding St. Somerton. The girls can’t be traced through all the search traps known to me, so some one please help, I need to know for the record and peace of mind.
….seems all is not lost in the case of Jim Beaumont’s long time missing sister Joyce Muriel who, it seems died sometime in 1966 aged 45 according to the MyHeritage people. In 2017 an Australian researcher G. Beaumont contacted the site as a new member giving details as a male of 60s age grouping. Only one person with those credentials comes to mind for me, he being a 57 year old US qualified realtor executive with connections to the very top eschellons of government based in Adelaide. He being a nephew of the long forgotten lady, deciding to use his birth name for research and not the one he had been given by his surrogate parents from the Mallee region in 1966
You follow a colleague on the trail like an experienced old wolf. Tirelessly and outright furious. Is there a question here? Or a warning! Surely you know how a certain Derek Abbott, who also tried to find out the secret of a dead man who fell drunk somewhere under the stairs to the beach, turned out. Derek searched and searched and searched until he ended up under the slipper. In chomout with Robin Thomson’s daughter. Rachel Egan. Happy New Year and good luck.
Josef Z. Prof: and the very best to you too my friend; we’ll need more than luck to make ’22 a happy and prosperous one I feel. I suppose old Derek might be consoled in having the drunk’s niece between the sheets, for to sooth his anxt should SM’s DNA become yet another SM catch 22 dead end to contend with.
Jim Beaumont’s uncle Alf, a tiny chap like most of the Winters, worked as a senior PMG linesman after his early WW1 discharge consequence of severe concussion (shell blast) at Pozziers which earned him a 12/- weekly pension. Somewhat ironically, during a job stint at Pt. Augusta, in 1942 he fell 14 foot from a first floor hotel verandah bunk and sadly succumbed. A tough way to vindicate earlier claims to the repatriation dept. that he was in the habit of falling out of his cot and deserving a few bob extra to compensate for his ongoing war caused trauma…ps in re Alf’s niece Joyce Muriel who would have been 21 when he died, she was still single aged 26 in 1947 when she was last heard from, that’s case wise of course.
In an addendum of fair tidings to all for 2022, it may be in keeping to wish Jim Beaumont a sincere and happy 97th birthday.
Of course most average street Joes are long conditioned to believing that the Beaumont kids, Jane, Arnna and wee Grant Jr. are by now long dead and gone for all intents, only interest now being in recovery of their remains and those responsible for the crime, ala the Mullins and Bray end game non solutions which I vehemently disagree with all my being.
I truly feel for you Mandy, this foul individual has spent god knows how many dollars and hours, (on geneology sites etc) trying to put together yours and your families backgrounds.
He has single-handedly tried to solve a crime and failed…
My heart goes out to you and your family at the stress he must be causing you all.
Most of us free thinking people in here just humour him, if you’ll notice that out of the hundreds of posts made here, they are nearly all from John, Big bad John…
I would say to try and ignore him, I learnt that when he was snipping at me a few pages ago. He likes to pick an individual and stalks them for a while then goes onto someone else.
This line sealed it for me, it’s hilarious really, he said:
“I’ve also written to the officer at least three times regarding my
connections to the Beaumont mystery and have not received any
acknowledgment from him or anyone despite being assured personally by the Police Minister that my input were being dealt with at the
appropriate level”
The police love saying that, and from a credible source, it means they have read your report and filed it appropriately, in the rubbish where it belongs…
This line makes me wonder, he seems to be injecting himself into the crime:
“I’ve also written to the officer at least three times regarding my
connections to the Beaumont mystery”
So he has injected himself into the mystery.
That comes across as a person with narcissistic disorders:
ie:
Self-centered
Superior to others
Need for admiration
Cocky….selfish….patronizing….Shall I go on?
More for future reference than current state of play, relates to the Beaumont family residential situation up to and beyond 1966. As posted, the old family home at 29 Lambert Rd. Joslin was where William ‘Grant’ settled after he wed Florence Muriel Winter in 1920 and where their kids were raised to maturity. She and her by then adult children Joyce, Grant and Max stayed on, after the old fellow passed in 1947, probably up until ’59 when for whatever reason S & McD. substituted tenancy of Mrs. F.M. to Mrs. G.A. Beaumont (Nancy). By 1960 the old place has been taken over by a new owners and we have Grant Alfred presumably with Nancy & the kids living at the terminal 109 Harding address. In ’61 Maxwell John was l8ving at a rental in 7 Mack Street Glenelg, then in ’62 he settled with his second wife and kids into a newly built bungalow at 14 Elm St. Oaklands Park. As for sister Joyce Muriel, she seems to have simply vanished without trace, though it’s quite possible that, if handicapped, she became a state ward after mum’s passing and simply disappeared; if in fact mum had died which remains just as much a mystery…
Any number of prople claim to have seen the kids in vicinity of Wenzel’s cake shop, the new one on cnr. Mosley & Jetty Streets, Glenelg, not the original ‘confectionery’ at 164/166, operated by Fred & Ruby since 1937, or the other one over in Brighton Rd. owned by their kids apparently. Strange thing is none of the sightings were varified during the initial investigation by police, until newspapers reported Fred coming out with his pound note yarn months later for confirmation of Jane buying half the day’s bake plus two large bottles of coke? not a bad deal for a quid plus nine bob in change so the the story goes. For those hoping for fresh news on Satin Man, Xlamb’s dad Alan McIntyre, ‘Darby’ Munro and half a dozen other paedo child slayers, go look somewhere else because I’ve got nothing for you, nothing but a little coincidental bit that came to my attention just now while doing my thing.
I wonder did anyone ever bother checking ‘old honest as the day is long’ Fred Wenzel’s story for absolute factual content ?, well no actually because he came forward of his own volition, never mind it occurring well after the fact. So if no one actually saw the kids go into the shop for their goodies and likewise, nor were there any witnesses to them exit carrying a large bag, how can we in all honesty accept what we don’t know to be true or not. Could be that they went in and never came out at all, perhaps they were taken out back and throttled or led off to a place far flung for all we know. Actually there does seem to be some sort of service exit at rear come to think of it and who knows anything of Fred’s backgroud, it was never brought up like many other relevant issues. Far as things go there, I haven’t come up with anything suspicious either, well not that punters would be interested in anyhow.
Fredrick Arthur Wenzel was German of course and a devout Lutheran, a lay person of the church near the shop, which certainly does not make him guilty of anything, unless he was a Goebels nazi. He was 62 years old in 1966 and close to chucking the pies, pasties and cream buns in for a well earned retirement, letting his three capable, well schooled children run the show, which they did infact do by 1970. Giving him and Ruby time to travel the world and live the good life prior to leaving it, which they also managed to do after a decent interval. The couple lived not far from Mosley St. in the rather pleasant suburb of Glengowrie, 15 Winston Street to be correct, also no distance from Somerton Park and just four houses down from their old Kapunda neighbours Cleve and Glad Snoswell who most ‘Satin man’ fanatics would not be so familiar with; So I’d best not get into their own rather interesting Missing Beaumont Children connection.
Ivé been reading an interesting blog on the SM man, I don’t know if this is of relevance or not but have a look here:
http://www.theunknownman.com/comments.html
And one more, has anyone interested in this mystery seen the video called Missing Pieces: The Curious Case of the Somerton Man…
You can buy or rent the video but you can also watch it for free, my favourite kind lol…
If this has been mentioned before on this page please ignore me….
https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x7ilbnm
@Deni – the first was maintained by Feltus as he released his book (which many agree should be the starting point for information). There are some who disagree with conclusions and/or some of the detail in the book, but as Feltus was a retired detective he likely had access to some details that few others could trivially find.
milongal: you had me stumped on how Gerry Feltus could have anything to do with ‘Somerton Man/Jim Beaumont connections’ (thread title). Then it dawned on me that, Gerry, lived fairly close to both Glenelg and Somerton Park, so probably had duties connected with the case, if only in a uniform role. It is also noted that the Big Footy Beaumont site, Deni’s dedicated home page, has of late been looking at our Prosper as a serious contender for perp in the children’s alleged abductions.
Was just responding to someone (Deni) that cited his site….
Thanks Milongal, I appreciate the reply..
As for me having the Big Footy Beaumont site as my dedicated home page, what a laugh LOL
I haven’t been there in months, it’s not my group, I just post in there now and then, like I do in here!!
I somehow think that JS is banned from seeing my posts in here, which is good, as I can join in the discussion without him insulting me all the time!
Australia day, Wednesday January 26th, weather forecast hot and dry, great day for kiddies looking forward to a last wonderful day at the beach before going back to lessons on Monday. Not so wonderful perhaps for our three Beaumont siblings Jane, Arnna and Grant Beaumont on a similar fine day 56 years ago in 1966. If only that Wednesday so long ago had have been dismal and wet things might have turned out different; alas we’re not to know are we. Thoughts must go out to their loving father Jim who must bear the unconsionable pain of that awful day for the remaining days of his long desperate wait for news. Bear up old soldier, there’s a better future in a promised fairer land for you and all who believe it to be so.
Stuart Mullins two books about his Satin Man Abduction suspect based on the delayed reporting of a tendered one pound note at Wenzel’s cake shop comes to mind. This being for purchase of pastries, buns and softdrink, as varified by a counter attendant ‘Cath’ who somehow recalled the kid’s purchase. Retired Det. Mostyn Matters who was part of the original investigating team obtained details from this witness for the book. He also interviewed the distraught mother on the day and who took a statement which stipulation that the kids were not permitted to go out unescorted but, she had relented to pestering and let them go. Most will recall it was this same officer’s postman mate Tom Patterson who remembered waving to the Kid’s near Wenzels in Moseley St. Glenelg but, couldn’t say exactly at what time or on what day apparently. Intetesting that Tom ‘the postie’ confessed to his old pal Mozzie in later years that he didn’t like talking about his time in the war… Tom in fact didn’t attend any war according to his service records.
The main problem I have with ex Detective Matter’s account of things is that it’s all a little too cosy and sympathetic to the generally self facilitating Mullins story line ie., Satin Man which is always a worry. Spanner in the works being of course the 1967 newspaper version that it was shop owner Wenzel who had himself come forward albeit long after the fact to vouch for having identified the Beaumont kiddies as his customers, from previous purchases. I’m not sure if it was he who introduced the pound note to us or his counter attendant ‘aunt Beth’, unlikely either way if one reasonably puts forward the argument of how much could they be expected to remember so long after the events in question…If one happens to be looking for possible suspicious goings on apropos Wenzel’s cake shop scene as I’ve noted previously, there certainly was a service way at rear leading off Milton St. breezeawy; then the coincidence of my main Snoswell family abode at Glengowrie and that of Wenzel’s being oh so close.
Deni’s equally unreliable Big Footy folk have had many volotile debate on certain belated claims of a former Nasho that he may have witnessed the kiddies buying lunch at Wenzels and overseeing their vehicular departure therefrom. A voluntary statement to Det. David Sheridan in 2015 outlines his having been called up for two years of military service on the day following his interaction with said kiddies therefore being oblivious to news of the event until his return from active sevice and resumption to civilian life. I don’t propose to add much to what was discussed between our two main BF antagonists but to say both their views are compounded by gross missunderstanding of the facts. Truth is that David Ridley Smith bn. India 2/5/45 was called up in late July 1965 and subsequently discharged in January 1967 after extending his T of D six months to acrue war service entitlements. His story to police that he was at the crime scene about 11.45am on 26th January on his lunch break from work is therefore a brazen fabrication. There are more details of Dave’s not so hazardous duties as a driver in the war which are not of importance to the Beaumont case, save to add that his Vietnam service did not commence until May, 1967, a full 18 months after the fact and ended six months later in December. Only thing I’m not privy to is the man’s death details, said to have been October 2019 at Port Elliott? of which I’ve been unable to confirm.
So strange, for the first time since 1966 there was no anniversary news items that I could find apertaining to the Beaumont case, and yet, to-day we are being flooded with stuff about a new BBC podcast on various historic missing children cases in Australia, of all places. If our kid’s disappearance forms part of it I know not but one would consider it most likely. Not sure what gives but it is strangely timely if you get my drift. I can’t get full details due to non entitlement and the everpresent pay wall that despite my assumed wealth, all that stuff is well out of reach to bums like moi.
This part of your post Johnny.
“Deni’s equally unreliable Big Footy folk have had many volotile debate on certain belated claims of a former Nasho that he may have witnessed the kiddies buying lunch at Wenzels and overseeing their vehicular departure there from.”
I don’t know why you would mention my name in that BS, you have posted about David Smith, Bryan Littely is to blame for that, as far as I’m concerned, myself and many many others think that Bryan groomed him, talked him into it. In OUR opinions.
There is a small video where Bryan is interviewing David and you could be blind freddy to think that he wasn’t reading from a script, he looked very uncomfortable..
Then you have Davids death, he left his war medals to Bryan, wouldn’t giving them to his own son have been more appropriate?
If I was Davids son I would be getting legal advice over that, he got left nothing.
Then there was Davids house, which Bryan helped to sell for, and don’t quote me on this, Davids wife?
I know he sold it, that’s a fact..
This is when Bryan became unpopular, and people started asking questions…
And Bryan, don’t come in here thinking you could sue me, all of that I said above is MY opinion, or things you have said, I have screenshots to prove it!!
David allegedly spoke to Jane and ‘the man’, on the reserve, not near Wenzels and I don’t know where you got your dates from but it’s been proven that David did go to war, or shipped over east on the way to war, in the days following the Beaumonts kidnapping!
On the question of David Smith’s claims to Det. Sheridan in 2015 at the instigation of his best friend, they must stand for scrutiny by Sapol and be tested on that basis, yeh or nay. If the man spoke to Jane outside Wenzels when he bought lunch there around 11.45am on Australia day 1966, I do not to know as I wasn’t present but don’t believe it to be likely. I can affirm through his service records, for anyone who is at all interested, David Ridley Smith, as stated in my penultimate post, was conscripted for National Service in July 1965 and subsequently served in Vietnam from May to December 1967. Folks who are able to deal with simple logics will note that the dates do not add up to the events attested to in his statement so, my only conclusions must be in the negative. Others can believe what they will which is only to be expected but, the truth will surely win out in the end and my version of it will be vindicated if the Good Lord wishes it to be so.
As luck would have it Deni’s most recent interesting and welcome critique of my work, promted a review of my David Smith posting of 27th ultimo in which details given for his army discharge is incorrect, it being 1968 as opposed to stated 1967. Strange that David’s best friend and former ‘Advertiser’ crime reporter, now in the equine trade at Victor Harbor, spoke of having taking on full responsibility for his deceased mate’s funeral and bequeathals etc., in that locality sometime in 2019, alas I’m not able to confirm even his death notice, so if any kind soul might have details I’d be most appreciative.
According to Deni’s colleague Bryan Littely, a Victor Harbor council staffer and horse fancier, police witness David Ridley Smith died in October 2019, he having attended to funeral arrangements and disposal of property locally. Strangely no records have come to light to date on the interment or left assetts etc., and details on death from septic infection by way of a motor vehicle accident may need further investigation. Dave Smith, who had been a first intake NS soldier from 1965 was known to have married a Bronwyn Agnes Bale post discharge, she having been born about 1947, to find what became of her, Deni could ask her friend Bryan. Her own posted details of the events witnessed on Australia Day 1966 are recorded In Smiths statement given to police and there may be mention of interaction between the deponent Smith and Jane Beaumont at a bakery (Wenzels 2 Moseley St.) which somehow does not accord with Deni’s recall, she should know, having lived right opposite at 1/7 Moseley St. Glenelg.
You said this Johnny “According to Deni’s colleague”, can you please stop this, calling him my colleague is very insulting to me, he’s more like the dirt under my shoes!!
I could NOT ask him anything, he blocked me on social media a couple of years ago, after he put a terrible post on his wall telling anyone who would listen that I was scum basically!
As for my recall, yes I lived in the terrace flats across the road from Wenzels, what does that mean?
David Smith did NOT see the children at the bakery, get your facts right man…
And leave me out of any more of your comments, I wasn’t a witness so there is no need for you to mention me!!!
Sorry Dunny, you lived at Elizabeth. If you persist with the the yarn of living at 1-7 Moseley Street flats opposite Wenzels, and for no reason but placement, you loose every which way.
David Ridley Smith (DOB 2/5/1945) Died 15/10/2019, cremated at Centennial Park 21/10/2019
Clive Turner: you’re better at this than I am, (not too difficult). I got David’s dad Frederick at Centenial 1987, no sign of mum Alice Elizabeth or David Ridley Smith on SA Geni. Centenial search, FAG Aust. NZ or Billion graves etc. Many thanks, I’ll try to be nice in future but, no promises mind.
Clive: I’m still rather anxious to find what became of Jim’s sister Joyce Muriel Beaumont bn. 1921 and mother Florence Muriel Beaumont bn. 1895. They disappeared from Josslin S.A. 1947 & 1958 respectively . Also Jean Gladys Langley nee Snoswell bn. 1927 of Somerton known to be still living in 2017. Maybe you could use your better rescourses to track em down if you have some free time.
I lived in Elizabeth with my father and one of my brothers, my mother, her new husband and two more of my brothers lived in the Terrace housing across the road from Wenzels.
My brother and I spent every weekend, from Friday to very early Monday with our mother, and we spent every school holiday, including that month of December 65′ and January 66′ at Glenelg with our mother!!
Seems that you Deni, may have gotten your mums address wrong as in the past, namely 1-7 Mosely [sic] which is Alexandra flats and certainly not opposite Wenzels as you assert. Both milongal and I tried tried to make this clear though you dug in and held firm that Wenzels at No. 2 did not occupy the Jetty Rd. Moseley St. corner position. In 1966 an insurance company at No. 1 and Dorrack flats at No. 3, both now demolished, were in fact opposite as would seem logical. The Alexandra flats, further south, bordering Elizabeth Street and previously No. 7 were allotted 1-7 as a consequence and remain so today. Perhaps should you wish, do provide us with a surname of tenancy (mum or new hubby) to enable validity of your fairly easy and thus prove or refute your school holidays residency claim; Otherwise you’ll find yourself as being just another of the usulal wanbabes who would like to put themselves at one of the touted abduction scenes as some mark of status perhaps.
Yea , I don’t think they were ever at the beach that day… Come on ppl make it make sense
A penny for your thoughts. It might go someway to clearing up certsin aspects of the claimed beach sightings, if full details of those who made them were released. In particular the two elderly and one middle aged women and those with whom they were sitting near the beach reserve. My doubts stem from my suspicions that they might identify closely with those on my list of possible accomplices to the ‘abductions’ which I believe was meticulously planned and included false witness contingencies to lay a false trail.
I definatley don’t want to put myself at any crime/abduction scene..
You have read me all wrong Johnny..
I know where I lived and I know that Wenzels back then was across the road from there, and that the bus stop was nearly directly in front of Wenzels..
For whatever it’s worth my mums and stepdads surname was Hancock and she was nee Turner..
Now stop trying to discredit me and keep tying to solve this crime with your twisted way of thinking…
Oh, and where has Milongal mentioned that to me?
Why do you say that Tarishea?
One of Janes school friends saw them at the beach on that day!!
I definatley don’t want to put myself at any crime/abduction scene..
You have read me all wrong Johnny..
I know where I lived and I know that Wenzels back then was across the road from the Alexandra flats, and that the bus stop was nearly directly in front of Wenzels..
For whatever it’s worth my mums and stepdads surname was Hancock and she was nee Turner..
Now stop trying to discredit me and keep tying to solve this crime with your twisted way of thinking…
Oh, and where has Milongal mentioned that to me?
milongal’s post was on the Wenzrls/bus stop location to me on 2/6/21, your uninvited but welcome response was 8/6/21. By then you had also given us to believe that your maiden name, or birth name was Hancock which, it now seems is actually your stepfather’s monicker. A simple error or deliberately intended, no matter. What does matter Dunny is that during a given eight year period, 1965 to 1973, no tenants named Hancock nor Turner rented any of the nine apartments at 7 Moseley St. Glenelg (Alexander Terrace), ‘directly opposite Wenzels bakery which appears to have left you and the Hancocks out in the cold. Now that my ‘twisted way of thinking’ missing Beaumont kids inquiries have been resolved, results of which both you and your erstwhile ‘Satin Man’ colleagues over the way will not concur, I’m left tidying up some frustrating ‘witness ID loose ends and waiting for Don Bray and his team from Safcol to come to the same conclusion.
….’directly opposite Wenzels bakery’ being your words, definately not mine nor milongal’s.
I know where we lived Johnny, you can check the stats all you like, but we lived there for a couple of years!!
First we lived in a lower one, then we moved into an upper one, then moved back into the lower one..
I really don’t give two shits for your opinions, wrong assumptions, I should say lol
I’m sure anyone familiar with the Wenzel’s cake shop connection is aware that it didn’t come to light until reported in a local rag a year after the abductions but, that the cops insisted had been part of their brief from the start which is most doubtful. Proof stems from the recent conjecture surrounding who served the Beaumont kids on the day, ex cop Mostyn Matters’ aunt Beth and Fredrick Wenzel, both claiming that honour. No sweat, just thought I’d place it on the record that apart from Fred, no evidence that the kids were there or seen leaving with their large lunch order has been varified. In fact my own feeling says that if they had, than some curious person(s) would have spotted them and come forward , perhaps they left via the rear exit on to Milton where being spotted was less likely, then maybe they didn’t leave directly. Brings to mind that Fred Wenzel insisted he knew the kids from ‘previous visits’ which Is debatable; but, could be he knew the Beaumonts from familial links between his wife Ruby Kluske and Florence Beaumont nee Winter, Jim’s (missing) mother. I’m pretty sure one of the other Kluske girls from Kadina married a Winter from the area in the thirties but I’m not heading that way just yet. NB. My other clan, of special interest were known in the Kadina/Nuritootpa area of old as were the Wenzels and even now a 65 year old lady Helen B-W nee Arnna Beaumont is known to the local Lutheran community..
Doesn’t figure at all dunny; At your old site, I recall you saying you lived in Alexandra flats from age five or six to ten now you seem to have revised it down to two years continuous tenancy. Neither is an honest account by my reckonning and I deal in facts. When the so called facts are lacking, “two shits” is about all we have left to chew on and that’s a fact dunny!!
Oh excuse me, I should have said a few years, meaning three or more…
I can’t tell you how I know how old I was when we left but in the years of me being 6-10 a significant experience happened in my life and they all happened at the the Alexander Terrace flats, and they stopped when I was 10 when my mother moved back to Elizabeth..
As for your naming of lady Helen B-W nee Arnna Beaumont is disgusting, I have spoken to David Snodgrass and I have seen proof that he isn’t the youngest Beaumont child.
I am hoping that either David or Mandy, who posted on here, speaks to a lawyer about the rumours you have been spreading..
I can tell that you’re a very lonely man, what with the amount of time you spend in here and also doing your research, it must take up most of your days and into the nights..
Why don’t you get a dog to keep you company, or if you already have one then why not get a wife, unless you’re gay, then get a man..
It really is sad to see someone of your age stuck on a site where no one, or not many, believe you…
I’m signing off for now, I can’t put up with your condescending narcissistic behaviour any longer. [MODERATOR: SNIP SNIP SNIP]
Take care Deni and do swing by occasionally and entertain us with your self labelled ‘dark sense of humour’ real soon y’here. We’re always in need of a chuckle at CMm now that Bozo is retired (sort of) and your buddy GC is undergoing life change issues. Jesus loves sinners though they be given over to bearing of false witness and be embittered with hatred of their fellows.
Delightful Deni’s recent disclosure that she had spoken with a certain David. S. @ my own Grant Beaumont, prompted a check on possible update to a MH familial search, made with a view to trace a Joyce Muriel & Florence Muriel Beaumont (the B. Kid’s Aunt & Gran). The researcher was under the name G. Beaumont (60’s) so we can reasonably assume that G. would stand for Grant who is presently aged 61. Only other possibilty would be Jim ‘Grant’ who’s too old and, so for Deni and other Harry the Silk Man fans, perhaps, in view of the forgoing it’s time for a re-think.
I don’t think there can be much doubt that the unamed fortyish woman and partner, group pictured with Nancy Beaumont and the kids in the 1965 caravan shot taken by Jim are their former Somerton neighbours Jean and Max Langley.
Some may recall that Jean was (is) the sister of John Snoswell and it seems quite likely that there must be a family snap of her for comparison purposes. I have every reason to believe she is still alive at age 95 and likely still living in the Glenelg district.
Not sure why the moderator, Nick Pelling, allows such garbage to be posted here. There is no truth, no substance to any of this. I’ve seen the photo referred to and know the people you are accusing of horrific things – these slanderous accusations need to stop. It is definitely not Aunty Jean and Uncle Max. I should know – I have known them my whole life.
There is a reason SAPOL has not responded to these ridiculous claims – they know 100% that none of it is true. They have told me this personally.
Nick Pelling – you have no morals. You provide a platform for what you know is not true and is hurtful to the memories of loved ones. You should be ashamed and remove all this garbage immediately as has been done on other websites I have been in contact with.
Simple fact checking would highlight how bizarre this fiction really is. Grant Beaumont is described as born 1961, brown hair, brown eyes, dark complexion. Me – blue eyes, blonde hair (as a child), fair complexion, born 1962, spitting image of my dad.
Nick – be a man and do something about the trolls that spread garbage on your platform. You have a moral obligation to do this.
I won’t post again. I know these idiots hiding out in Vietnam love reactions to their garbage.
David: the comment you’re blowing up about actually said nothing of the sort. You’ve turned yourself into a worse troll than the guy you’re complaining about. Get stuffed.
I don’t blame David for posting what he did..
David and his family don’t deserve the treatment that Johnny gives them in here.
He’s made up stories which have hurt David’s family, he has proven that he isn’t Grant Beaumont, did you read this bit?
“Grant Beaumont is described as born 1961, brown hair, brown eyes, dark complexion. Me – blue eyes, blonde hair (as a child), fair complexion, born 1962, spitting image of my dad. ”
If that doesn’t prove anything then I don’t know what will, blue eyes and born in 62′ should be enough proof that he isn’t who Johnny thinks he is..
He’s not just complaining about one message, he’s complaining about all the messages about him and his siblings and there are quite a lot in this thread…
He’s stalked me looking for amo to throw my way from Facebook groups and on the Footy Forum, he’s accused me of lying and not living where myself and my family lived in 66′, I don’t lie, and I don’t appreciate being accused of it!!
And Nick, how has David turned himself into a worse troll than the guy he’s complaining about??
And with that little sentence, you’ve actually called John a troll, well done LOL
Deni: moderation is rarely an easy or enjoyable task on an active site, and anyone who leaves messages directly slagging off the moderator has fully earned being called a troll. You both dislike John Sanders, and that’s probably entirely fair: but that dislike doesn’t translate into a right to control line-by-line what appears here or anywhere else.
Such a respectful old lady to call me by my given name for the first time which I take as a compliment of the first order. Could it be that Deni wants to be my very special pal after all the one-way criticism of the past – I’m on the hunt for a good description of Grant Beaumont as a four year old and would be pleased if anyone has seen ‘dark complexion’ crop up.
From what I recall Grant is the splitting image of his father [Grant] Jim Beaumont.
For once we seem to agree on something Deni, IS being without doubt the operative and essential definative vtb when all is said and done. Thanks for the heads-up.
How do we agree on this John?
I said that Grant was the spitting image of his father, Jim Beaumont!
“Grant Beaumont is described as born 1961, brown hair, brown eyes, dark complexion. Me (David) – blue eyes, blonde hair (as a child), fair complexion, born 1962, spitting image of my dad. ”
Deni: your own interpretation of Grant Beaumont’s phys and of David’s description of himself be both mute, as it appears neither can be supported by an authoritive source. However, I do most emphatically agree with your own telling third person singular present tense of ‘IS’ (to be now), as opposed to your past tense use of ‘was’ (to have been) with regard to Grant’s status in your follow up re hash of the original wording. Tut tut on you for the deliberate gaff second time around; I didn’t miss it!
A little known blog has surfaced in my searching and has a piece from a newspaper around those times.
This is what it says about Grant, and I must say, even if this is an overseas site, they have done a great load of research..
“Grant Ellis Beaumont
Four years old (born 12th July 1961), 91 centimetres tall, thin build, and brown hair with a fringe. Like his sisters he had brown eyes. He was very sun-tanned and had an olive complexion.
On the day in question, he wore green cotton shorts over green bathers which had vertical white stripes. He was wearing red sandals.”
Below is the link, but I wanted to share something with you that might make you giggle, it made me laugh, but then again I laugh everytime I come in here..
Andrew has made a new video, in it he claims that Max gave the children a one pound note and took them to Wenzels. He has never once mentioned a one pound note until now.
Rachel and Ruth have never mentioned it, so Andrew has now taken ownership of the Wenzels bakery story…
When will that family ever give up!!
Oh, how did ‘Grant’ change his eye colour from brown to blue, and don’t say he’s wearing contacts, that’s a cop out!!
Here’s the link to what I said about Grant…
https://missingmadeleine.forumotion.net/t4405-the-beaumont-children
P.S. Look for posts by milly on that link, and be sure to go to page two…
She has done better research than most people I know!!
Deni: Thank you for your attempt in trying to convey some common sense in this ridiculous fantasy story of John’s. It really is quite unbelievable that he continues to pursue this even when there are family members commenting on his false facts. John, let me say this one time and one time only. Your facts are completely inaccurate and we don’t need to prove or disprove anything to you. Do you understand you are a complete laughing stock? Just ask SAPOL and every one of our family members!
And as for you Nick, how dare you! How dare you tell a family member from who’s family is being associated with such a falsified story that is downright slanderous to get stuffed! You bloody well should be ashamed of yourself, instead of actually looking at this from our point of view, and doing the right thing, you have your knickers in a knot from being called out! A troll, really? That’s just about as ridiculous as every thing John has said. It’s not about controlling what is written line by line, or liking or disliking a person, it has actually come down to someone writing blatant lies that have no factual basis. How is that ok with you? And if it is, you bloody well get stuffed!
I, like David will not be commenting again as we actually have a life. Good luck to you all.
Mandy: if you had responded to what had actually been posted rather than on the emotional (and troll-like) overreaction it provoked, you would now yourself be looking less like a troll.
Deni: I had a quick look at that page (thanks for the link). It appears that much of the text in the comments has been cut and pasted from an ebook, which I’m guessing was Whiticker’s 2006 book on the Beaumont children (which I haven’t seen).
NP: Couple of items from Deni’s ‘Milly’ posts, not new but well worth re gurgitating from past posts, relate to SM ‘Ron Francis’ suspect Doug Hendrickson’s tireless search of sand dunes behind Minda home in co ordination with the dutch mystic Croiset and under supervision of Det. Len Brown. The other being top contender in improbability stakes, is in that the 9pm letter allegedly written by nine year old Jane Beaumont to her absent parents just two days prior to the abductions?, has the detailed structure and gramatic effects one would expect of at least a teenager or for that matter a well educated adult in my view.
Actually Mandy Lee, having reviewed all my comments of this case, starting with the ‘Castalloy second dig’ site (closed) of which I have retained my own comments, plus those posted on this page please take note that; I have never made one single derogatory or slanderous remark towards the main families of my particular interest. This as opposed to those such as Deni’s group that have consistantly run the Harry Phipps ‘Satin Man’ unsubstantiated connection scandal without let up for years, thereby puting his reputation and that of his family in a precarious situation of guilt implications. Think about that and come back to earth my dear.
To John Sanders, I have read quite a lot of the rubbish you have written about our family, and may I say a lot of unsubstantiated crap. I am one of 4 children of John& Dorothy Snoswell and I can assure you we are all Snoswell’s . It is actually a blessing that our parents have passed on in recent years as this sort of garbage that is allowed to be printed , is something that I am pleased they have not been able to see. My brother David is able to speak for himself as he has and labelled your claims as ridiculous, but your condescending remarks to my daughter Mandy are in my opinion pathetic. I think the modern term for someone like you John is keyboard warrior, and in my mind a pathetic individual who would not have the guts to meet face to face with the people he is attempting to make a story out of. That offer is open to you John, happy to meet in person at mutual ground when ever. As for you Nick Pelling , I believe you are the so called moderator? I am not sure what your job entails Nick but on the little bit of what I have read as soon as you are challenged you have to revert to labelling people as trolls or telling to get stuffed etc. Anyway that’s all I will be saying , to you John and Nick I think you are both pathetic weak individuals , hiding in your dark rooms printing bullshit, I think you are both trolls and in finishing of you can both get stuffed.
Richard, David & Mandy: nothing to back my alleged derogitory assertinons of your family’s connection to the Beaumints you say. Well for starters there was Nancy’s betrothal to your uncle & great uncle Bronte Snoswell in 1947 and her friendship with his sister, your aunt and great aunt Jean Langley. who with husband Max were lived two hundred yards from the Beaumonts at the time of the abductuons and left withunn weeks to a unknown location. Mums’s sister also lived nearby Dick and these few pieces of circumstancial tidbits make up just a very few justifiable links to a case worthy of pursuing imo. If however you good folks have contrary proof to disaffirm my so called bullshit allegations (please point to a single one) like simple proof of birth for Dave, Jill and Helen to John & Dorothy Snoswell…I’d suggest put up or forever hold your abusive tongues.
NP: I’m detecting a lot of somewhat suspicious verbage and unusually similar sentence construction within the posts of Deni Tomlinson and the alleged sibling Snoswells Dick & Dave, with addition of Dick’s mid thirties daughter Mandy Lee Clark. Do you see it, or am I being paranoid? Note that nothing in any of their combined undignified rants lends even any evidence to support their respective claims of uninvolvment, which is usually a pointer to deception or concealing the truth…As for Dicks’s offer of man to man combat at any place of my choosing, on checking the man’s phys during his hustings around the auctions, all I can say is that he must have something else that he’s concealing from me.
JS / Dusty
Fathers are very protective of their daughters. And of their younger brothers. If you have experience either relationships, perhaps you might understand.
I could furnish a birth certificate, we all could, we could show photos of mum, dad and the four kids, we could show school class photos pre 1966. They are probably held in the Keith Community Library if you want to check. Given how invested you are in this, perhaps you should start paying the fees to access more accurate information.
We could put you in touch with friends who have known us from the early 1960s or earlier.
But why would I do that to someone who I don’t even know, who is probably using a pseudonym, and is not an authority I need to answer to?
The thing is, I doubt any proof provided, you would believe. It seems to be a pattern. SAPOL is aware of these accusations and told us to ignore them. And yes we should have! But lies are hurtful.
I even suggested a DNA test to them, which they laughed off as they know from other investigations that this story is fiction.
The whole basis of your fiction is that Uncle Bronte was once engaged to Nancy Ellis. It is a big stretch to get from this fact to everything else. You even once suggested Uncle Bronte married my sister! Retracted, but it is an indication of your preparedness to write anything on this website.
You say mum’s sister also lived nearby? The one married to Bryce? Well I think I would know who my auntie was married to. I’ve never heard of Bryce.
And the farm at Keith. Sparsely populated, calling it near Ngarkat I guess makes it sound very isolated. Well the farm also borders the Dukes Highway, which is the main road between Adelaide and Melbourne. Now that is hardly where I would go to hide three abducted kids. Plus mum and dad moved there in 1963 with their four kids and were very much involved in the community. But lets embellish the story a little more.
The definition of Slanderous – A False statement about someone that is damaging to someone’s reputation. I think accusing someone of abducting three kids is both false and damaging to my mum and dad’s reputation.
You are also welcome to message / email me. I know you have the details as you have stalked my LinkedIn profile.
David: yeah guess I do know a little about protecting daughters, I have three and, even while you were compiling your nonsensical tirade, devoid of any supportive evidence as usual, I’ve been nursing an inconsolable five month old hungry grand daughter while her mum went up the shops with the grandmother. Theyre back now just in time for me to effect a timely hand over and to check on your latest miserable efforts to thwart my progess in search for answers re our missing Beaumont kids. By casting untrue allegations as to my slighting of Snoswell family reputations past and present you should be kind enough to point them out in that others may see what you’re so pissed about. In the mean time you’ll not deter my efforts unless you can provide the necessary simple proofs of familial blood ties to the Snoswell clan which neither you or your three kindred? antagonists have been inclined to follow up with. I understand that you intend to press your complaint to Sapol, as is your prerogative; Indeed I’ve made some attempts to do likewise, with support of SA’s past A.G. and it’s Police Minister, though without response. So good luck with them but, if not take a civil injunction with claim for defamation against me against me; that or come and watch Dick and me duke it out for honours sake at Keith sales ring after the late autumn cattle auctions…PS as for my wishing to contact you in another format; no purpose would be served other than to create ill feeling which is not what either of us should be seeking…Maintain the rage by all means if you desire but, on this forum so’s to keep punters engaged and yes, expect no let up in my firm but honest responses Mr. David Grant Snoswell.. PS by my contacts with local government, I understand the former family holding retains a very narrow chisel front on Dukes Hwy at Snoswell Rd. turn-off (Coombs), the original house being back some kilometers north east and bordering on uncleared scrub near the Ngarcat park entrance. A far enough distance to hide three kids or three hundred if need be, by any fair assessment…
Correct you are David, that is, in relation to the Ashendens, Bryce being married to a Noeline Joy not your aunt Noreen Joyce the error showing up after re appraisal of my old notes. The gaff was due to a hastily drawn assumption on my part that the pair were one and the same, both born in 1929 and laid to rest at Centenial Park. I’m first to admit my blunder and thanks for showing me up..touche in order.
…Dot’s big sister Noreen was a divorcee and we’re not to know who she was married to, leastways my research can’t pick it up….the following piece was taken from some publication which picks up on the interesting somewhat inaccurate details of an early potential lead, though results of any follow-up are not to hand.
‘ In the last few photocopied pages of the Adelaide CIB phone log, there’s a reference to a photo published innthe Sunday Mail dated January 29, 1966. Taken in May 1965, when the Beaumont family were on holidays on Yorke Peninsular, it shows Jim and Nancy with Jane, Arnna and Grant, and an unidentified woman……are good friends (sic) with the Beaumonts, who are surprised that they have not heard from them since their children disappeared. They (my emphasis) have no children but recently they have stated that they intended to adopt some.
By my reckonning, and I’m quite satisfied of it, the bloke with his mishappen left hand upon Jane’s head is not Jim at all but likely to be friend and Diagonal Rd. neighbour Max Langley and, the unidentified woman, surely his good wife Jean, they representing the unheard from couple wanting to adopt…Perhaps Dave or Richard Snozz might like to add their own summations on the above but if so mindful of Mrs. Langley’s maiden name.
Should it be of any interest, Max Langley, assistance insurance manager, flew into Australia from Port Moresby on January 7th 1971 giving 38 Chopin Rd. Somerton Park as his address. In 1966 he and Jean had been long term residents back along Diagonal Rd. towards Glenelg which they left at about the time of the crime.
John, why do you keep referring to ‘Deni’s’ group, I don’t know what
group you speak of, if it’s the Footy forum then I haven’t posted in
there for months and where on earth did you get the idea that I might
be typing for Mandy, David, and Richard?
You are being paranoid as you asked, most of your rants are paranoid
and now you come out and say ridiculous things, like you arn’t going to
stop with the Snoswell family. You won’t speak to them personally, only
in here so you can intimidate them with your shocking lies, does it
feel good to belittle someone, don’t answer that, it was a rhetorical question, it’s clear that you do like to imtimidate others..
You said this:
“If however you good folks have contrary proof to disaffirm my so called bullshit allegations”
This one little thing that you ignore John, I have seen several photos of David and his beautiful blue eyes in adulthood..
I wanted to know if it’s scientifically possible to have ones eye colour change over time so I did some research on it. It is possible for ones eyes to change over time, but not the actual colour, whatever the eye colour is in infancy only gets darker as you age for some people, so people with brown eyes can become a bit darker and the same with blue eyes, they become a darker blue, but not brown..
You say you have three daughters and i’m guessing the grandmother is
the wife? No matter, do they see what you write, I know if you were my
dad I would be disgusted in you, the way you speak to Mandy and myself
is nothing but attention seeking and vile, do you have no principles, no moral compass?
Have you had a look at the posts on this page lately, everyone has deserted
you, except for milongal now and then, and a couple of other hangers on..
I would hazard a guess and say that at least 95% of the posts were from
you, and I would also hazard a guess and say at least 95% of the members don’t come in here to read your ‘opinions’.
As for the reason I come in here, it’s because I like to see what far fetched narrative you are writing on the day..
You also wrote this:
“In the last few photocopied pages of the Adelaide CIB phone log, there’s a reference to a photo published innthe Sunday Mail dated January 29, 1966. Taken in May 1965, when the Beaumont family were on holidays on Yorke Peninsular, it shows Jim and Nancy with Jane, Arnna and Grant, and an unidentified woman……are good friends (sic) with the Beaumonts, who are surprised that they have not heard from them since their children disappeared. They (my emphasis) have no children but recently they have stated that they intended to adopt some”
How could you possibly know that Jim and Nancy didn’t see these people
again, I call BS seeing they were friends. I’m sure that if the woman was close to Nancy she would have been there to comfort her, say what!!
Troll on good sir, when your time comes on this earthly plain, and by chance you get upstairs instead of downstairs, you’ll be able to ask them youself..
Deni…and if you happen to get there before I do Sweetness, hows about checking out a cosy spot for this harmless old avenging troll. Somewhere under a bridge over the Styx run off would be ideal. But not too close to yon harpies cess pool if you can and, conditional on the g’ment coughing up the freight in advance mind!
David: you say that mum and dad moved to the farm at Ngarkat in 1963 of which I’m well aware from my own self funded research, but for a missing fourth sibling of course. So perhaps you might enlighten me as I appear to be one short in the count, ie., Jill, Richard and Helen. By the way with regard to Bronte and Nancy, if you care to swing by the S.A.genialogy web site, now sadly a pay to play set up, you’ll find a reference to them having been married. Mindful of possible error I checked further and found that this may not have been so, hence my hasty retraction; you can hardly blame me for the gaffe then, now can you old bean.
….but of course the fourth sibling could only have been our then year old blue eyed babe in arms David Grant; how forgetful I’m becoming.
Under the bridge with the rest of the Trolls, consider it done, as long as I get there first!!
So now you have changed your story, are you now saying that David is not Grant because of the eye colour thing I mentioned ?
And because I mentioned the years of birth were different ?
Deni: our TSM colleague Peteb over at Tomsbytwo happens to be looking for a ‘certifiable fact’ and, I’m thinking you’d be a dead shoo-in. Mind if I give him your facebook details.
You can give anyone my Facebook details, I can’t stop you, but thank you for asking..
I can’t promise i’ll speak to him but hey, give it a shot!!
Two Beaumont girls on the family tree are yet to be accounted for; I’m not talking about Jane and Arnna who, with younger brother Grant disappeared in 1966. The kid’s Grandmother Florence Muriel along with maiden aunt Joyce Muriel who left the picture in 1958 & 1966 somewhat mysteriously, also need to be accounted for. Seeing that I’ve used up all my limited research skills I’m now seeking further input from the ‘Jim Beaumont connection instigators, master sleuths Samuel Z. and Byron Deveson plus thread creator NP to lend their not inconsiderable talents in chasing these rarely discussed Beaumont ghosts for the sake of some threadline clarity.
Good work as a historian I think you’ve got it right , Nancy was a costume maker and a granddaughter following in same footsteps I see, and yes a pickle as far as disrupting people’s privacy, who was Nancy worried about in the long run to miss out on rearing her own children?
If this was myself missing as a child I would be thankful for a man like this to work so hard to unravel the clues to find me, with those that for some reason want to hinder his search I wonder why would you do that when a man is trying so hard to find these children let alone to be horrible to him if he has opened up the truth, if that was so there are other little children out there missing that needs his involvement , we have all cared for these little children and it would be nice to learn that you are OK and if there are reasons that can’t be spoken about at least let people move on to finding other people that want to be found by helping someone that has put their whole life aside cause they cared about you. .
A recent prominant commenter from Big Footy blog, has continually made links to an unidentified suspect in the both the Beaumont Children & Adelaide Oval abductions as being likely one and the same. ‘The Man With The Crazy Walk’, a Herald Sun newspaper headline misread of Daphne Gregory’s in-part description that her suspect had ‘bowed arms like an ape’ no mention of his gait, this along with an assistant groundkeeper at a footy game having spotted a stooped man following two young girls seven years later, well intended no doubt but, the three descriptions be quite at variance and misleading in my view, in that readers of like posts will be making connections to both sightings as being suggestive of a single culprit, all due to editorial hyperbole in one case, then to a disimilar description given for a potential abducter in a much later case at a different venue. Surely we can do better than taking this sort of line when dealing with a class of evidence, one that demands solid foundation of facts, not mere fanciful opinionising.
Growing up there was a man that entered our stationary car in the main street and was half in and staring at my three year old sister here in south Australia I immediately from the front seat I was in the centre between my mother and the driver my cousin reading her newspaper and blocked the man from my sister, I was nine, I stared that man out and seen through his blue cold eyes, he Appeared distant and I made him bothered where he backed out and disappear amongst the busy street fall of people, my elder sister was watching from the newsagent, mum thought it might have been a police officer thinking my baby sister looked like little Beaumont girl, we all had similar hairstyles back then, I thought when staring at him he got aggetated like maybe a memory of Jane Beaumont me being of similar color hair, well grew up my sister and I staring at the t v every time the face came up about possible person of interest, done a search when I had a computer years later and seen Arthur Browns photo and hundred percent sure it was him which proves to me he was in south Australia down the south east in 1969, problem is no one ever took it as serious where I think it’s important piece of info.
Heather: I’m sure you’ll have noted that Arthur Brown was a man aged 58 in 1966 or if preferred 65 in ’73 which, for what is worth, is not consistant with the upper level range of late thirties given by credible witnesses in the Beaumont/Adelaide Oval abductions. As for your own graphic memory of the deep blue eyed ogre you saw as a child, later transpositing these vivid pictures onto the similarly haunting gaunt features of Brown from North QLD that is not surprising at all. I’d remind however that this particular fiend had distinctive hazel eyes, whatsmore prominant scaring of his left hand and foot sustained when in his twenties. Of course that can’t rule him out as a suspect for the alleged abductions in Adelaide although it must certainly give rise to a fair degree of caution when tagging him as the main suspect…in my opinion if that counts for anything. PS check through some early Beaumont posts to find an AO suspect I nominated in 1974 named Parks from memory, an itinerant fairground worker and suspected child molester who came with a police mug shot and a likeness to both Arthur Brown and various sketches.
Hi John I can’t find the photo of the fair grounds worker you mention, this man that entered the car I believe is Arthur Brown he was dressed very well in a darkish grey suit with old man’s type matching hat of those days, after staring him out for what felt like a long time face to face nearly and I as a nine year old was not going to let him get to my little sister No matter what, I remember wanting to blink but knew if I did it could have given him a chance to make his move, when he first got in the car had his knee in already, he was tall, I remember we all looked around when the door opened. I seen My baby sister like a scared little rabbit I was not going to forget what he looked like as this is my baby sister and it’s important, my mum thinking probably a police man where I’m thinking a police man would not do that, when he walked off quickly amongst the crowd I said to my mum what if he comes back around the other Way and opens the door to get her, mum didn’t think that would happen. Then we had a new baby in the back of the station wagon I said what if he gets her. Mum said he would not be able to open the back which I thought cause he could and then two little boys bouncing around in the back of station wagon they could be in danger, well mum thought he’s walking toward the police station direction I was not easily convinced a thousand things going through my brain even worried about kids from school living that direction. Well went home my elder sister a I running to Dad but he said everyone is OK so don’t worry, I said what if he comes here. dad assured me he wouldn’t my big sister and I looked at the drawn face of the man of the Beaumont kidnapping as we grew up but never spoke about it till a few years back but I knew the picture was not the same face I’d like to see this other man’s face you speak of but Arthur Browns face haunts me and I’m glad I have not forgotten cause I had to take him on to save my baby sister cause no one else was there in that position like I was and if he had of grabbed her I needed to not forget his face it was important to me and I think it’s a clue that should not be overlooked, I know it was 1969 as we had the new baby in her bassinet in the back of the station wagon which was legal back then..
Looking at suspects of Adelaide oval abduction and can’t see Any that resembles the man in our car the only one is Brown. I can see perhaps he might have a hazel coloured eyes in these photos but the distant empty eyes are hard to forget, he wasn’t expecting me to stare him out, it agravated him and made him feel uneasy as he backed out of our car I was nine and he looked of a grandparent age, older than my parents age who were in their thirtys at that time , can’t find anything on the Parks man you mention.
Heather: You’ll find the Parkes/Parks post on the ‘Somerandumstuff’ blog under the ‘Failed second castaloy dig’ threadline and dated 26th November 20i9 but, My original post is right here at ‘Jim Beaumont Connection’ and dated 24rd May, 2016 though without mention of the suspect’s name. I’m still hoping that someone with access to old Commonwealth Police Gazette can trace the Parks (?) mug shot from a pre ’75 Supplenent.
Hi John looked at everybody and everything I could find, I see the apron 60 year old photo of Brown, I’m sure that was him that day in 1969 without a doubt he was in our car that day, it can’t be anyone else it was him. I have some genealogist looking at your site one said the Police, historical records centre might be handy. Still looking at all your other research I can’t see why your research is being ignored.., also thinking this man that entered our car middle of the street we’re in the car it didn’t seem to bother him who was around he was just going to snatch my sister and walk away , busy street people everywhere he disappeared real quick in the crowd I was shocked how quickly he was gone and he could have had her he was just gone real quick.
Interesting reading that a Mr Hill, I think his name was had been stuck in the traffic mentioned that he seen the children walking with the tall athletic blonde haired man a woman and a man seen around the horse racinng club and that he thought it was a bit strange their parents weren’t with them as he knew of them, wouldn’t that make sense say if your genealogy research was to be right in some way
Heather: Scott Hill, a well known Adelaide author was relating the story told to him by his dad it would appear but, credible nonetheless and reliably sourced from memory. Descriptions given of the trio (plus the children) at the top end of Augusta St. Glenelg on said date, whilst not as complete as one might desire, do fit rather well with my key suspect, not to mention that of his pretty dark haired wife, both being of the right age grouping as well. As for their young ‘strapper’ companion, it is known that the couple had a teenaged nephew who’s family lived nearby but of course speculative identification must be considered with caution. You may search further for Scott’s full account which I’ve sadly misplaced, to see what Ive missed.
Scott Hill is on FB lots of questions from other people from all over someone asked if his father mentioned who the strapper was seen by his father with the children that day they disappeared you would think his dad would have known if he knew that If he was a stappper and they were all close friends.
I have some doubts about clarevoyant Hill’s claim to also being a childhood pal of the Beaumonts , though his birthyear of 1958 fits and there was a J. S. Hill living at 161 Brighton Rd., not far from 109 Harding St. where Scott remembers watching the kids at play in their yard and remembers police enquiring at his house after the disappearance. I’d like to know more about his dad’s part in the investigation and any connections with the local racing fraternity. Without those details it’s all a bit self serving and looking at the fellow’s book promos one can’t help being wary.
Kinda thinking the same, and funny how all involved have high schooling and doimg well with in the connections, it surely wouldn’t have been hard to find the so called strapper seen with the children that day as he would have been well known amongst the horse world, not sure whether I ever heard that the father Jim liked putting bets on the horses or not, it was a outing for a lot of people in those days and being in the area, I think if that was my Dad and we were missing, he would have combed the area till he found this man in order to find us and especially coming from good mate and family friend ?
Looking on my heritage it has Florence Muriel Beaumont born 1895, no date of death and then daughter Joyce Muriel passing in 1966 and brother Maxwell passing 1966. If I remember Joyce born 1922 can’t remember Maxwell birth, they’re a bit young I would think, maybe trove would have something if there was an accident etc ?
Looking at Geni genealogy site he has Maxwell and Muriel passing 26 Jan 1966 circa. It certainly is food for thought although it is what he and others have written only, the death notices are now available up to the 1970s I’ve been informed, did something happen to Jim’s family. Was he involved with the wrong persons and perhaps the innocent family members were all in danger ?
Heather: Maybe you’ll have better luck with the missing women than I of late, I have lost favour with the censors in that connection of lare for some reason so I’m hesitant in naming them as you thankfully have. I’ll dare to chance my luck one last time with our strangely reluctant moderator on Jean Gladys Langley bn.1926, she beng possibly the only living witness to the lead-up events of ’65 in my estimation. So maintain the rage by all means whilst your luck holds and best of British …..
Heather: Look up my earlier posts on Jim & brother Max and note my queries regarding certain entries or lack thereof in their respective world war two files at NAA. Same might apply to Bronte’s late wife Joan Estelle Lynas whose connections to Dawes Park Repatriation hospital in the 1940s are not to be found on the usual search indices; there are however birth notices for her kids from the fifties, two girls and a boy though their names and fates have not been established to date.
Heather, you said this:
” I know it was 1969 as we had the new baby in her bassinet in the back of the station wagon which was legal back then..”
You mentioned 1969 several times, well the fact is that the Beaumont children were taken in 1966, and the Adelaide oval girls, in 1973..
Hi Demi good to hear from you, yes 1969 I said our new baby in her bassinet , she was born that year and the baby sister that was being looked at was a small three year old born in 1966 therefor it was 1969 I was nine that year my cousin who had the two little boys that were bouncing around as energetic as they were in the back of the station wagon where the bassinet with the new baby was, very much against the law now days as children need to be in proper seats, I remember that year well as cousin promised to buy me a Barbie doll, I ended up with a Mimi cut out doll which at first was a little disappointing but I realized she had no money and I did enjoy that Mimi doll and all the paper clothes that went with it, cousin stayed in town on odd occasions from another town, so 1969 was definitely the right year of my ordeal with this man entering our car, of course I can not say this man was in SA in 1966 or in the seventies but I think as I am sure with my ordeal that it was Brown well that says either he travelled to Victoria with going through my town or decided to holiday down the South Eastern SA area that year, it gives a clue of his moves during the 1969 time limit sadly he moved on in time to continue his horrible crimes, my ordeal is that my sister could have been another of his victims if I hadn’t been there that day which thinking how devastating that would have been to me and my family. Thanks for your interest Demi.
Heather: thanks for the clarification of the original narrative on your personal experience that puts Brown firmly in South East S.A. in 1969 and directly within your childhood memory span with clear total recall. This will indeed be a magnet for the usual petty naysayers, those who typically set out to entrap you by useing the fools time honoured ‘you said’ jargon in an effort to reveal inconsistencies in your story line. They’ll usually then follow through by casting aspertions on own credibility, but not to worry though, folks with any degree of logic and reason will appreciate perfectly what you have endeavoured to explain in your related posts. Plus, a big plus at that, those with a modicum of decency will respect your right to put forward your thoughts in a clear and concise manner for due consideration. PS…You also know how to keep your cool under duress and that puts you well ahead of the online ratpack, self included.
“those with a modicum of decency will respect your right to put forward your thoughts in a clear and concise manner for due consideration.”
When have you ever done that John?
You have never respected my opinions, so in turn, I don’t respect yours!!
And Heeather, enjoy your time in here with John..
P.S. Ivé heard your story before, but i’m sure your name wasn’t Heeather, where do I know you from?
Hi Demi you are right my story has been put out there using names for my family members to protect their privacy and baby sister finds the fact that she was to become prey to a evil man too much to bare, I am one that wants to find the truth. Demi I have spent many years working with elderly genealogist including tracking my parents families and have found people that make no sense whatsoever and wonder what they get out of life by hindering another person research when they have all the proof in records etc to prove that they are right, I wasted much time crossing paths with them and so glad when they drifted off to annoy someone else and I was not the only person they made a nuisance of themselves to which is a shame as had they have been different they would have had something to offer, you know quite well that Johns research is very important for all the little children that are missing and I believe he is right and wish David could help since he has found John’s research which for some reason has upset him, his family the Snoswells and the Beaumont family were closely connected therefor one would think that David would want to help clear the misconception up if that was so, why you Demi would have a part in that conversation between David and John’s words one would wonder why. John thank you for seeing my ordeal as an important clue to Arthur Brown. I had also as four year old at my grandparents house seen a man get through the window and fumble around my three cousins beds, they all went to sleep real quick, there was no lights back then just the moonlight he then walked towards my elder sisters bed I was watching thinking he could see the whites of my eyes pannicking and felt relieved that he didn’t go near her then my baby brother in his cot was next then me, it was time to scream for help which made the man go back out the window, grandma came in with the lattern followed by uncles don’t remember seeing my Dad, but they searched the cliffs and found no one, we were put in another bed room, years later at grandparents when I was seven in another room with Mum and the same cousins, they never locked the door and same thing happened same man patting around cousins beds, I screamed and grandma come running with the lantern Mum said go to sleep there’s no man, here I am sitting there eyes wide open I’m the only one awake watching for his return till I dozed off. A few years ago before my Dad died he pointed to a young girl working in a bottle place and said that’s the granddaughter of that man that you saw running around at grandmas house, Dad combed the place and found where he had be laying in the dirt along the railway tracks that went through the back paddock the bloke lost his cuffling that was engraved with his name, Dad said don’t say anything as his granddaughter probably idealizes him, moral of my story is I have been in many situations from a young child and had to save my family from strangers some how I have found the strength when needed. Speaking to a lot of people both young and old and have Learnt of what has happened to them growing up, there are many situations where children have crossed paths with the wrong people and have felt uncomfortable and happy to have not been a victim to them. In most cases, it’s wrong place wrong time but what you have uncovered about these missing Beaumont children seems to be much different with so many clues, why would these children play with this man he must have been familiar or known to them for them to be as comfortable as to play the way they are said to have, now why would you buy food enough for a long trip if you were going to do away with these children them being hungry wouldn’t bother a person like that, then the blonde haired man to me looks like the army photo I came across when looking everything looks like its not just a kidnapping of mere chance, and why would you grab three kids why not just the one , think you are traveling in the right direction and hoping more clues will be found, I do hope that people can help and stop making a mockery of your research cause it’s very important what you are doing, thank you John.
Heather – Try seeing this from my perspective. A person I don’t know is spreading outrageous accusations about my parents and extended family. I know they are false.
You mentioned that you think people are saying horrible things to him. I don’t understand why you seem upset by this but think it is OK what he has said about members of my family. It is horrible. It is slanderous. It is defamatory.
I am not going to provide birth certificates, photos and other private information to a complete stranger. But would happily do so to SAPOL, as I have indicated to them in correspondence. I have indicated in a previous post that he can make contact with me to discuss. He has chosen not to do so, which is fine.
I have also passed information onto SAPOL about these accusations. They are the ones tasked with trying to solve crimes after all – not a blog full of conspiracy theorists.
Finally privacy is an important concept. You have said you changed names of family members to protect their privacy. You should protect mine, as should all people in this post, by not mentioning my family name. I too would have preferred that my parents’ names were not dragged into something they had no part in.
With respect Hepther that was very hard to read.
If you had used punctuation and paragraphs it might
have been a lot easier.
As for D, he is a lovely man who has had a change of eye colour since he was ‘Grant’…Scientifically impossible, definately not from brown to blue.
His year of birth is different too, and for his sisters.
You shouldn’t even be mentioning D’s name in this post, it’s defamatory.
And saying ‘Johns research’, is an oxymoron, he just fits things together where he thinks they will fit.
“there was no lights back then just the moonlight he then walked towards my elder sisters bed”
What do you mean there was no lights, of course there were, we were all told to come inside when the lights came on and that was in the 60’s and 70’s, and sometime into the early 80’s, we actually had ceiling lights and lamps, electric ones, you make it sound like the dark ages, oh and don’t forget the torches.
Could you tell me what cliffs you lived near, I lived in Glenelg at the time, well part time, weekends and school holidays, even though John disputs that, I have no idea why or how, anyway, I don’t remember any cliffs so if you could tell me where they are I would really appreciate it.
Then there is this clanger lol.
“A few years ago before my Dad died he pointed to a young girl working in a bottle place and said that’s the granddaughter of that man that you saw running around at grandmas house”
How did your dad know who the man was, he never saw him and i’m sure your child like description wouldn’t have been any help.
And finally, what I have uncovered, along with many thousands of others going by the new book coming out, and their last book, plus the many many witness’s, which I don’t include the McIntryers in that, as far as I know, Johns account is one of the only ones that think they are still alive.
Also you think that people might “stop making a mockery of my research cause it’s very important what you are doing”, thank you John.
The only person I see that is making a mockery of anyone is you and John, your snide little remarks, your insisting that D is a Beaumont, is getting a bit pathetic and I truely wish there was some way to shut you up!!
And lastly, why have you thanked John at the end of your fictional speech, is it because you are Johns alter ego. I’m not casting aspersions here but you have just popped in from no-where, and besides your woeful grammar and your lack of punctuation and paragraphs you sound like him LOL
P.S. Look up Karen Brewer, that maybe you in the future if you keep going along these lines!!
Hi David I can understand what you are going through problem is that the connection with the two families are there as you can see yourself. I don’t think John is in any way trying to upset you. he really has gone about his research in a proper manner but sadly that has come to close to you and your family names and connections in order to uncover the past. All of us historians follow the same footsteps as he has. I know this can be upsetting to one’s that prefer to be private David with the conversations I’ve had with John he appears to be of a good character and so do you. Is there anyway both of you can do a bit of combined research together as you being in your position where something terrible has happened to your families close friends from the past leaves questions that should be searched there were three little children just swept up and never seen or heard of again which sinks in to the heart of ever good persons on this planet of course you don’t hand over your personal photos to a stranger, the fact that your birth certificates don’t appear to exist gives a question. Back in the early days it was easy for people to adopt their children out if they wanted, there was no help for families like there is today so there are many children that have grown up and are looking for their natural parents and siblings it is not uncommon, David can you look at this situation from a different angle of how you maybe able to help John in a manner where you are able to make sense of the situation where the research has a lead to you three children same age very similar in many ways family connections any good historians can follow this same path and come up with you. David, John didn’t ask for his research in the missing children to lead to you where he is now in a position to close the book and just give up on them as if they never existed left in the past where people are more eager to just say they’re dead and be happy with that than to try and find them so that their souls can be laid to rest, I think they deserve to be found. David can you help in any way, you are a very smart young man you have followed the trail that lead to you now how can one move a head with out a different outlook I say it’s best to work along side of John as a friend and see what you can both find to help unravel more clues from the past otherwise the research stops here and others in the future will be on the same search. It is not Johns fault. If I had of followed these clues I would have found you to. He does care about these children and he does care about you to I find when your in a situation that is not a easy one it’s better to be a fly on the wall and look at it with a clear vision to be able to see it better ,Thank you lovely to hear from you. .
Demi if you are doing a book wish you well and hope you have a lot of people wishing to read your version but don’t nit pick myself or others for following family research on the missing children which appears to be what you are doing yourself yet have different opinions, now my conversation with both John and David are with my best wishes to both of these men to find closure on their Different options and I say again to you Demi it is between them to sort out their differences not you so please go back to your own research and stop being a nuisance ,lovely to hear from you, good day
Hi John looking at Joan Estelle Lynas, there are a lot of family historians looking for family members and I am yet to find anymore than what you have, all of our families are being researched by people we do not know, it is a well known interest for many, I am sorry that after all your work that you are in the position where one does not know their next clue, I am sure it will come when you least expect it, I do hope that David can help with some family history he might enjoy sharing , just as a history point of view as it would be nice to learn more about great Grandma along with Aunties and Uncles from his memories instead of what records show of them which can be deceiving I have been critical of others in history adding their versions to photos on ancestry myself as they are family and there are things I am careful with. There are many men that came back from the war and their medical records of syphilis etc is there in view for all historians to see, we are in the world of the computers, records are easy to view both on line or at libraries, not a lot is sacred anymore, I do feel for David and his family and in full knowledge that nothing in your researching was set out to hurt him or anyone else, it’s all part of following clues and searching for answers, we all do it, everybody is on facebook ancestry records are available everywhere, old newspapers, I questioned family graves being on the internet and was told it’s public property I can not do anything about it, I hope without interference you and David can work together to move on to leaving good feelings about the research you have undertaken in good spirit and for a good course. Thanks John.
Hi John, just wondering if you have already looked at the missing Beaumont children, birth certificates, whether they would hold a different clue or not. Perhaps a different father or something.
Nick Pelling: Seems that you and most punters would prefer that this matter be dead & buried to accord with David Snoswell’s recent false claims of defamation against his sisisters and innocent adoptive family. If that be their own collective desire as expressed in no uncertain terms to that end, then so be it. If I’ve read you wrongly then my apologies but, for your part you might make some comment on where you stand rather than ducking for cover….Heather: keep hammering away as is your duty to truth, but walk softly and carry a big stick..you’ll need it!
Come on Admin, let me have my last say on this whole debacle.
You let John and Heatar say things about me and D, you let them slander and covertly abuse myself and D…
Isn’t it only fair that I have my last say, because i’m done with these two.
A little bit of respect, which we don’t get from either of them would be nice..
Thank you!
Do you still have my comment in the wings??
Deni: to be fair, I’m getting a bit bored of this thread, there seems to be far more effort going into creative-sounding mudslinging than into actual research. For the first time ever on Cipher Mysteries, I might actually lock this thread from accepting any more comments. I myself have any only a faint interest in the Beaumont children cold case, and even that small amount is rapidly getting eroded.
Nick Pelling: and fair enough too after all it’s your show. Here’s me thinking for quite a while that you had some new strategy or direction that you were perhaps keeping to yourself, more recently I got the feeling that you had been put into a similar position as some who closed shop for fear of reprisal. So it’s pleasing at last to finally get it direct from the horses mouth..complete and total disinterest in a nutshell….Let it be said in closing my own online commentry on the Jim Beaumont thread that I have not once slandered, insulted or shown disrespect for anyone especially members of the Beaumont/Snoswell extended family on this site or any other and as for Deni’s own unfounded accusations to the contrary, i can only ask others to look for themselves. To finish off I’m more than pleased with results of my 45 year interest in the Beaumont abduction case and stand by my commentary of same with no regrets…Nick please do me a favour and allowing me to thank those kind souls like milongal, Byron, misca, Peteb, more recently Heather and even your good self (to some degree) who have let me to say my piece without allowing personal feelings towards get in the way. I hope I may garner similar cooperation from other wise heads down a more progressive path for I don’t intend for a New York minute to let the dark forces get their way. js
Fair call Nick, I respect that, although I still have that post saved in case you change your mind LOL..
But by all means lock the thread, in my personal opinion that would be the better option, then my inquiring mind won’t be forced to have a peek at what others are saying.
You probably don’t know how a womans mind works, we can’t help ourselves and if we see something as ridiculous as what ivé seen in here we have to comment, if you take that choice away from me I would really appreciate it, as i’m sure David would too, and also this thread is going very close to being used as a deformation action on David’s behalf, and I doubt you want that, especially because it would affect your whole site..
Plus you have to admit that any new comers that enter this thread would be either disgusted or would be forced to comment and then the thread will go on and on..
So yes, please lock the whole thread, the rest of your forum is excellent, I would even send people your way that are interested in the other sections here, as it stands now, I wouldn’t do that because I don’t want any of my friends to see this page..
Kind regards,
Deni 🙂
Big Footy realists: please be informed that I am not now, nor have been a member or contributor to your respected site, under my birth name of john Sanders nor any other for that matter. Rather than quote from Deni’s latest interesting but uninformed self serving post, I would implore those following this case to read and evaluate for yourselves all my previous articles on this thread and comment here or elsewhere as deemed appropriate. Note that I harbour no deep seated ill will towards Deni or any member of her nominated (discreetly) family in question and I’m confident that you will find nothing of the like in what I have put forward for evaluation. Moreso I stand by my convictions without fear or favour. As to the latter’s claim that I am “close to being sued for defamation”, how do I respond but to say that if the cap fits I must wear it. You be the judge good people.
TTT @ Big Footy: the photo was taken over Port Lincoln way in ’65. Fellow in the pic with his gammy left hand on Jane’s head is Max. He and wife Jean also in the frame hoped to adopt children according to Nancy but never did. Residing in Diagonal Rd. Glenelg they disappeared after the abductions then, in ’68 built a home in nearby Somerton where they settled. Max was ex navy and made at least one post war visit to PNG. The injury to his left hand is so noted on Max’s RAN inlistment papers. js
Tue @ BF: so, if the kids were given new bikes for Xmas as you say, then did that include four year old Grant and what about the tricycles Jane & Arnna seemed so attached to in ’65 as seen in file pics, mounted up and uniformed ready to head off for school with Grant standing between his smiling sisters. Or was that just a dress rehearsal for heading back to classes the following Tuesday 1st Feb ’66.
for what it’s worth the busroute DropBearess refers to is probably what used to be the 33 (and in the early 1980’s became the 340 and was split into more city-centric routes in about 2005 (about the time Serco lost their contracts to Torrens Transit (part of what is now known as Transit Systems Australia)).
The (convoluted) route is recorded as:
33 — Port Adelaide to Marino via
Commercial Rd (Facing North)
L St Vincent St
Hart St
L Carlisle St
R Bower Rd
L Sansom St
R First Ave
L Military Rd**
R Grange Rd
L Seaview Rd
L Burbridge Rd
R Davis St
R Ingerson St
L Indian Ave
R Northern Ave
L Cambridge Ave,
(L/R across Toledo Ave ) Rio Vista Ave
R West Beach Rd***
L Military Rd
Patawalonga Frontage
L King St
R Adelphi Tce
L Anzac Hwy
R Gordon St
R Jetty Rd
L Moseley St
L Pier St
(Across Brighton Rd) Diagonal Rd (## This is Beaumont section, I think)
Morphett Rd
L Sturt Rd
L MARION SHOPPING CENTRE
L Sturt Rd
R Diagonal Rd
R Seacombe Rd
L Brighton Rd
R Scholefield Rd
R Kauri Pde
L Singleton Rd
L Cygnet Tce
L Cameron Ave
R Bandon Tce
L Jervois Tce
R (I think) Newland Ave, MARINO
Returns via the reverse (possibly more directly out of Marino to Brighton Rd).
Can’t remember if these were changes to the original route, or were how things changed when the route was split up
**Possibly Later modified to visit West Lakes ??
*** Possibly Later modified to visit Harbor Town
johnymac1: I know that my position on so the called BC abductions is resolute, hence not so popular with your status quo ‘Satan Man’ clique; I was never a huge fan of candidates the likes of Arthur Brown, Henry Phipps, Jim O’Neil, Bevan Von Einem, ‘Darby’ Munro, Dave Smith or for that matter former front runner Derek Percy. In respect of the aforesaid and your smart observation that he was going to school in ’66, so more likely a ‘copycat’ using BC news generated data to plan later outrages than the actual purp, you might need to think again. Agreed Percy was in year eleven and went into year twelve for a bit in ’67 before becoming a driveway attendant at Jesmond prior to joining the RAN on 25/11/67. So what, the Glenelg abductions went down on Australia day during school holidays which therefore renders your point rather moot, would you not agree?
So called most reliable eyewitness descriptions given of child abduction/murder suspects in a number of unsolved celebrated cases during the mid to late sixties in three Australian states are not consistent with their pointing to one lone wolf offender. Take for instance the Beaumont Children from S.A., in which the main suspect was said to be six feet tall, mid to late thirties, with light brown hair, an athletic build and a tanned complexion. In the 1968 Linda Stillwell case the main suspect was said to have been only 5ft 10″ and, in at least one other case the suspect was described as having a dark complexion. Derek Percy upon enlistment into the RAN in late 1967 stood 5′ 8″ tall, had dark brown hair and a fair complexion; So where does that leave our Big Footy team’s general conscensus that Percy is guilty as hell in every single histerical case? Right where it should be, in extreme jeopardy for mine…and that’s being rather generous, generous to a fault if may be so bold.
And then came Big Foot Draftee Inspector Gadget, bringing with him/her a long overdue approach to a site taken over by a collective of ‘If you scratch my back I’ll scratch your arse’ buffoons. His/her logical counter to popular belief that a mere teenaged lone wolf deviant from out of town could be capable of spontaneous forced abduction, slaying and disposal of three well drilled local kids from such busy place like Glenelg foreshore is compelling. To have taken the children under the noses of beachgoers and ever alert life guards at the shore, then leaving no trace of his ever having visted near the crime scene, Percy would need to have been a chamelion and a clever one at that. As an alolescent Derek was said to have been deviously clever but, I doubt he was in the same league as Jack the Ripper.
For sanity’s sake Nick Pelling, will you do as you mentioned and lock this thread please?
Now Johnny boy has no one to duel with he’s answering folks over on the Footy Forum in here, and using their names..
This has just become ridiculous!!
Deni: you can call TTT, Tue, Johnymac1 & Inspector Gadget names as you wish. Most intelligent Big Footy punters will see them for what they are, discreet site identities, aliases or initials. You’ll please acknowledge that my form of address for each of the above is no different than one might expect and polite too. As for the ‘johnny boy’ label of which I’ve now become well used, no offence to me mate; Just so long as you’ll answer to ‘my old doxy’, as a form of endearment of course.
‘Percy done it’ punters in need of convincing that he was not involved with the Beaumont kids disappearance might wish to turn off the lights and go back to dreamland or else consult with higher ranked members of BF’s dead-dic-ated blog. On Australia Day, 26th January1966 at Jesmond NSW a thousand miles from Glenelg, holiday makers were driving back home from the long Xmas/New Year break for start of the new school year by their thousands. In the case of Ernest (Tup) Percy and sons including 17 year old Derek, business must have been brisk, their newly leased Shell petrol station being situated near the Newcastle approach exit of a busy intra state Highway. OK I can’t say for certain that your killer was on duty that day but odds against would be slim, especially in that his RAN inlistment record shows occupation being (service station) driveway attendant. I might point out that young Derek himself was mere days from starting his sixth form final year at school, so having to destroy evidence of his crime, pack away his specialized murder weapons for the long trip home might have been a close run thing, though I honestly dunno!
The material published here is not only of poor character, in fact, this is criminal.
I would advise the Snoswell family to speak with a legal practitioner who will be able to serve this individual with a cease and desist notice. I’d also encourage the victims in this case, Snoswell family, to file a suit seeking an award to the sum of any damages they’ve incurred as a result (inc. potential loss of earnings), you have a solid and well documented case – you don’t need to continue being victimised or suffer in silence, let the legal system help you. This is an unprovoked attack and a viscous attempt to character assassinate an entire family with unsubstantiated claims. My other piece of advice would be to consider taking legal action against those who own and are responsible for the operation of this website, the moderator, has by their own admission, willingly and knowingly allowed their platform to used as a facilitator for this criminal offending – it is culpable negligence on their part.
Jacquie: “viscous”, heh.
May I please ask what your area of expertise is? I only ask because you seem to know substantially more about mouthing off than about the Law.
Jacqie: your falacious assertions be provocative, insulting and baseless. So before advising your alleged victims of any willful slandering of their good name, or as to their legal position on a civil suit they might wish to proceed on in that connection, you might first give very careful consideration as to a basis for the terms upon which any such action might succeed. Your identified family certainly won’t find any culpabilty connected to this site that would validate a case for either criminal or civil proceedings to the best of my understanding on defamation laws.
Worth mentioning is my recent disclosure that a newly arrived immigrant family, John and Glenys Bickerstaff with their three young kiddies were possibly living at 2 Milton Street at time of the disappearance. They had rear access onto a breezeway twenty five metres from the Moseley St. bus stop and, likely as not access to the rear of Wenzell’s bakery. Some may recall that a woman came forward months after the event claiming to have seen a boy child being taken from a laneway into a vacant house (4 Milton St.?) near to where the BC were last seen. The Bickerstaffs left the area soon after and moved to Nth. Brighton. So I’m thinking that the late informant may well have been someone like Glenys Bickerstaff constantly on guard against her kiddies straying down the breezeway to the busy throughroad exit.
Jason_Recliner: Derek ‘the dork’ Percy was not known for his charismatic persona, so we can put paid to any suggestion that he had used his charms on the kids to earn their trust and affection for leading them off, unlike the Pied Piper to their doom. At the other end of the spectrum Jane Beaumont was known to be a shy and withrawn child in the presence of strangers; so we can be certain that if she had a new (?) boyfriend at aged nine, as has been played up over BF way, it would be even more ludicrous to make that link to a dag like Derek Percy.
You are entitled to your own personal opinions Nick, I am not interested in having a nonsense debate or slanderous argument with you. As an alternative question, consider asking yourself why you feel my comment was ‘mouthing off’? I wrote a short sentence describing the material that I observed as having been published on here. Further, I offered some advice to a family. yes or no?
You can agree or disagree all you like Mr.Pelling, my advice hasn’t changed. The Snoswell family should speak with a lawyer and explore their options of resolving this matter in civil court, in my view- they have a strong case and I firmly believe that they should pursue justice for themselves.
If what I’m saying has no validity then there’s nothing to worry about. Is there?
Personally, If I where in you’re position- I would just be done with it and take what steps I could in an act of good faith, I’d air on the side of caution and just delete the thread entirely, at least hopefully minimise potential personal liability.
Kind regards,
Jacquie
John –
I believe you think you’re a champion of truth and that’s nice. I can also appreciate a desire to engage in stimulating conversation online, but you’re very nearly talking to yourself now, and perhaps it might be time to stop talking and maybe find something related to ciphers that you could research and contribute to this blog. You might be surprised by what a positive reception you’d get for some new insight of that kind. Anyway, just a thought.
I appreciate you taking the time to respond John, it’s unfortunate we’ve only became acquainted through such a sour exchange of pleasantries. As I mentioned earlier to Nick- I’m not interested in engaging in any type of nonsense.
I have a feeling you might be trying to play some silly buggers with me John, I think that you’re actually a lot more intelligent than you’re pretending to be.
Jacquie: what your saying has no validity and so there’s nothing to worry about. If you you feel otherwise, you might justify same by producing evidence of anything slanderous, accusatory, vitriolic, libelous or insensitive you’ve come across in my comments to date regarding the family at the centre of your unseemly tirade.
D.N.O’Donovan: same does not apply in your case old thing; you being conditioned by now to my self defensive diatribes aimed squarely at folks who piss me off like your good self Right?
Jacquie: I suspect John’s better at pretending to be intelligent than you give him credit for. :-p
John, I regret to inform you that I am not obliged to assist you with that, what you want to believe or what you choose to think is hardly any of my concern.
I fear you might of let this theory consume you, it doesn’t seem healthy. It might be in you’re best interests to take some time out and consider whether or not this might have developed into a bit of an obsession for you.
As D.N.O’Donovan and Demi have both pointed out: you’re trying to have conversations with people who aren’t even there.
get well soon
kind regards,
Jacquie
Nick: My hope was to try and appease that incredibly fragile ego of his ..I thought, if I could do that, then maybe- just maybe-I might be able to spare myself from one of those ridiculous theatrical responses of his.
Jacquie: yeah see your point thanks; you sound a lot like one of Gordon Cramer’s surrogates PeteDavo with your “I fear you might of….” gaff….A great English poet Walter de la Mare played that one party conversation game for all it was worth. One verse that comes to mind, today in particular is ‘The Listeners’, also title of a Ballet by Juliet Prouse which had it’s world premiere on 30th November 1948 – to celebrate Somerton Man’s own last dance. How about that?
“ Jacquie: yeah seeth thy pointeth grant you mercy; thee soundeth a lot liketh one of g’rdon cram’r’s surrogates petedavo with thy “i feareth thee might of…. ” gaff…. A most wondrous english poet walt’r de la mare did play yond one party conv’rsation game f’r all t wast w’rth. One v’rse yond cometh to mind, the present day in particular is ‘the hark’rs’, eke title of a ballet by juliet prouse which hadst it’s w’rld premi’re on 30th novemb’r 1948 – to bray out som’rton man’s owneth lasteth danceth. How about yond? “
How’s that?
Speaking of the Somerton Man, how wrong did ‘he’ get that!!
I know I laughed and several of my friends as well..
So i’m back on moderation, figures!!
Deni: you’re not being blocked, the comments were getting overheated back in May so I basically did a timeout on everybody, like a circuit breaker.
For the new voice of perceptive reason Inspector Gadget, I’ll repeat my belief that the Percy family were unlikely to have attended any regattas during that December ’65 – January ’66 holidays. In those days private ownership of a gas station was an all family affair and the Percys would have been no exception, especially in that Tup Percy’s new Shell outlet at Jesmond was a make or break venture for future prosperity. There is little doubt that Derek and his brother would’ve been flat chat at the pumps and cleaning windscreens as demanded by a constant flow of holiday traffic heading home to Sydney on Australia day 1966. So as I said don’t trouble yourself further with this diversion. It’s a well orchestrated side show aimed at frustrating Denny’s struggling Harry Phipps Satan man deviants.
Good idea Nick, it would still have been an idea to close the whole section off, just make it read only, but your call.
I agree with the moderation, it does make sense!!
John, can you please explain to me what the difference between conjecture and evidence is?
Jacquie: evidence is that part of the law which regulates the mode by which courts proceed in determining existance or non existance of the facts at issue between parties to a particular proceedings. Conjecture on the other hand is what a certain type of individual will endeavor to pass off as a given, despite a lack of knowledge or understanding upon which to base their proposition. Hope that helps with your quest whatever it may be. js
Thanks John, I appreciate you’re help.
Just to double check quickly that I understand properly: you’re most recent ‘Inspector Gadget’ comment – that would be a good example of something that’s conjecture, yes?
Jacquie: a best case scenario based on a combination of known facts and logical progression of events is a fair assessment of my last ‘I G’ comment. Better than an hypothosis but certainly in need of better proof so as to completly discount many baseless theories of Percy’s involvement in the BC disappearance. Conjecture falls a tad short by my estimation but, that’s conjecture, yes?
I don’t remember when I have said Phipps was definately the perp John, I have my ideas in several camps, Phipps being just one of them!, that is conjecture on your part!
And speaking of conjecture, wouldn’t your tale about David and his sisters being the Beaumont children and living happily ever after be conjecture as you have no evidence, ie: DNA, when all you have is a loosely based friendship between Nancy and the Snoswells?
Also while i’m here, could you please show me proof of Derek’s father owning a gas station in the 60’s.
All I have seen is this:
“Percy’s father, a sailing enthusiast, had been a New South Wales railway electrician before deciding to take a job with the State Electricity Commission in Victoria, and moving to Chelsea in 1954, then to Warrnambool in 1957, and to Mount Beauty, near Bright, in 1961.”
And this:
“Percy admitted to being at Glenelg Beach in Adelaide on a family trip on the day of the disappearance, but denied any involvement.”
The story goes that him and his family were there on a holiday at that time, they drove there in the fathers car.
I would have to say that all of that is written evidence, not conjecture, no?
Oh, and I forgot this:
“In 1965, the family relocated to Khancoban in New South Wales (their sixth move in twelve years) where Percy began writing down bizarre and violent sexual fantasies.”
Have you given thought as to why this happened, Deni Moore?
What if he did the Beaumonts in whilst on vacation?
It seems the Marshall connection is the most viable. The marshallfiles website eludes me on waybackmachine, as do the comments from the Smithsonian site.
Please keep your crappy theories to yourself.
Logical progression? Ever wondered about the most logical progression of events in relation to the Snoswell family?
Humans have a natural drive to eat, drink, sleep and procreate. These actions are in accord with a natural law for a species to survive.
The most logical progression of events? That the Snoswell children are a result of two people fulfilling their biological inclination to reproduce.
People have babies John, it’s really not that suspicious.
I was of the same understanding Deni, hopefully John will be able to enlighten the both of us when he provides the supporting evidence he’s got about the gas station
Jacquie: it’s probably better at this stage if I reserve my comments in the Beumont case out if my sense of decency to those adversely affected by your disturbing and childish on line sherade…..You’ll find unrefutable supporting evidence for the Shell petrol station at Jesmond and it’s establishment in late 1965 if you care to search the comprehensive Derek Percy biography on the Murderpedia site…No need for an apology in doubting my word, your departure from the scene would serve just as well…even better that you take your unseemly alter ego with you.
You best reserve you’re comments out of you’re own sense of decency to those adversely affected by my- my disturbing and childish line charade? 🤨
You shouldn’t just believe everything you read online, if you don’t have a verifiable source for the information or the supporting evidence to back it up, it’s probably best not to just target and single out individuals to pick on and write about behind their back’s on another thread, the reality is- you’re not even certain yourself, Mr. Sanders.
Anyhow, I had a look on the murderpedia site you just mentioned, and yes, you were right, I did find some things .. and I quote:
“The abduction and disappearance of the Beaumont children. Police have managed to establish that Percy was near the scene of the crime when the children went missing “
“At the end of 1966, having repeated year 11, Percy was ready to leave school. His father also decided to leave the mountains to move into private enterprise. He invested his payout on a Shell service station in Newcastle.”
For what it’s worth John, you were right about 1 thing: I don’t need to be sorry for doubting you at all.. “at the end of 1966” the Beaumont’s disappearance- as we all know was in January 1966. January is at the start of the year.
Ever wonder why Nancy and Jim divorced? Who blamed whom?
Max McIntyre had the phones tapped that day and he knew the old boy would be in Snowtown.
Nancy sent the kids off to the beach in the morning because she couldn’t deal with the heat?
No. I’m sorry but the story is crap. People didn’t let their children do that.
Not ever.
for someone talking to himself, he sure gets a lot of engagement from people suggesting everyone else should ignore him
Nicely spotted Deni, whoops Jacqie. You picked up on an error in the otherwise reliable Percy bio. in that Derek had actually finished year 11 (5th form) in 1965 not ’66 and that the family service station business was established also in late ’65. He started 6th form on 1st February 1966 but soon left school altogether and went to work full time as “driveway attendant” for the hew family business. That fairly mundane employment carried through until Sepember ’67 when he ‘joined the navy to see the sea’ which proved not to be a wise career move for one of his mental fragility. PS the RAN must have known something was amiss upstairs because Derek only got shore postings in his two years of service prior to arrest in late 1969….Nice to have been able to help ladies; free to contact our mutual colleague Gordon Cramer should you need expert advice on just about any subject under the sun, excepting espionage and secret writing tecniques.
“People have babies John, it’s really not that suspicious”, the quote courtesy of Deni in her Jacquie disquise; seems somewhat nonsensical in form especially the ‘suspicious’ word ending which can’t possibly relate to anything I’ve said about the Beaumont or ‘Llewson’ families..such comment suggestive of a disillusioned and warped mind be my best guess.
You think i’m Jacquie, or that Jacquie is me John?
Oh boy, how did you come to that conclusion, we write nothing alike, and to be honest, if I was going to write the things she has then I would have worded it much differently.
I never would have asked you what the difference is between Conjecture and Evidence for example, but i’m glad she did, it would never have crossed my mind.
So I am certainly not her, and she is not me.
And while we’re on the subject, in the past you have told me you have never had another name on the net, but a person called Dusty has nearly written word for word about your Snoswell family among many other things they have said that you have said, so were you Dusty, or visa versa or who plagiarized who, you or them?
Timing really is everything, isn’t it?
What an overly convenient moment for the supposed (Sally) to jump in with such a low, provocative comment. It would appear to me that you’re primary motive is to incite a reaction, you’d hoped to instigate an argument, you’re a class A troll. You (the supposed, Sally) wrote you’re comment with an ulterior motive, you see- you did this to try and distract attention away from the fool that John just made himself look like, hmm?
You should really just learn to just accept you’re errors and admit when you’re wrong. Making such a vile statement like that, you ought to be ashamed of yourself.
The pathetic just keep hitting new levels of low.
Oh Aillsa Stewart honey, you can’t even get Demi Moores name right, one is Deni and one is Demi, i’m sure she would be insulted..
I see you’re partly in the Percy camp and partly in the Marshall camp, so which one is it, it can’t be both surely..
But you can’t put up a good argument as to the reason why you think that, a few lines with an insult at the end does not make a credible post.
Now keep going if you like, but please show us some written evidence on why you feel that way!!
And Sally Fletcher, you and Ailsa Stewart must be rampant Home and Away fans to have matching names from previous characters on the show..
If it wasn’t so silly it would be sad, be original whoever you are, post under one name, and please, I implore you, do not bring up Max on this page, he has been well and truly discounted in here, as has any stories by the family, although there are probably still a few die hards in here that believe in that fairy tale..
I’m embarrassed for you to be honest!!
Did you know about this Deni? We’re the same person 😂🤣😂
Might that be some guilt that I’m detecting John?
Deni, John and an there’s an open invitation to anyone else who would like to have a laugh at another one of Johns false statements ? Shall we all Skype together?
(The supposed Sally) will you be joining us?
Deni: On june 2nd 2021 you asked me accusingly how many fake accounts I had. It was incidently the same post that included an invitation to visit your Face book pages @ Deni Tomkinson and Dawn Hancock. Anyhow I replied vis. “….I have one and one only (account) by my last reckonning and whatsmore I’m not ashamed to use my God given name when online or in any other capacity. Dusty was a NdP deeded to me in jest by an unseemly cohort Peteb which I used thence forward as a convenience and as a mark of (dis) respect but, your accusation of some idiotic breach of promise be a sign of total distraction…You and your shadow might do well to take note of the following me old Doxy…”Oh what a tangled web we weave when first we practice to deceive”.
What have we got here?
The Beaumont children are Jestyn’s third cousins. The Harknesses and Beaumonts are two families well known to each other and socialise widely over a long period. Jessica knows Jim and they end up living close.
Prosper is a taxi driver – so is Jim….
Prosper and wife probably offed Somerton.
The Beaumont’s uncle Max is a kiddy fiddler with a conviction.
And none of us can join the dots hey?
Nice work sleuths.
“I asked you accusingly how many fake accounts you had.”
That’s conjecture, I didn’t ask accusingly.
When anyone has asked about my names I have been nothing but honest, why hide it, Dawn, Denise, Hancock maiden name, Tomkinson married name, I can use any form of my names legally without having to explain it.
But again, Dawn Hancock is mainly for my family in England and Perth, and my very close friends in Perth where I lived until 2001 for 22 years.
I have never once hidden the fact that both accounts are mine.
I’m sick of explaining it to people really, but I will if needed.
I have a some of those family members on a private family group I have in Facebook. Would you like their names?
I also have a few people that call me Dawn on my Deni Tomkinson account, I don’t pull them up for it, take today for example, it’s my birthday and ivé had someone say Happy Birthday Dawn on my Deni account!
Can I explain it much clearer than that?
If you want to go further into my life, my mothers maiden name was Godden, she had a kind of secret life, well secret to myself and my brothers here in Australia, we migrated here from England in 65/66, I can’t quite remember which year, but I was 5 or 6. We always knew her as Jane, but that was a lie, her birth name was Gladys and she wed a Canadian soldier when she was 16, and 5 months pregnant, he was 29, he went back to war and disappeared, little did she know that he was just missing and would turn up one day. They had two children, one son and one daughter, I found them on Facebook and got to meet my half brother when he came out from England about 8 years ago. My half sister had since passed away, hense I was the only living girl. My parents gave a son up for adoption between my oldest full brother and the next oldest when we lived in England, that is a bit of a mystery as I can’t find him, even though I have a digital copy of his birth certificate.
So all up instead of the 4 of us living here in Australia, my mother actually had 7 children :O
Now let me get this correct, Dusty was your Nom de plume right?
If that was the case when I asked you if you had any other accounts in different names you lied to me?
Whether you were bequeathed it or not, you still used it as a false name, yes?
I wrote all of that just in case you ever decided to stalk me somemore, now you know it all we can move on about names..
And you were correct, ”Oh what a tangled web we weave when first we practice to deceive”. It’s all on you buddy!!
Deni: on 4th June 2021 relating to your ACCUSATION of my having internet accounts in multiple names, I replied as follows “I have one (name) and one (name) only by my last reckonning”. Note the date and note that of my last BC thread post as ‘Dusty’ on the Ultimate Sommerton Man site which, from memory was likely late 2020 or early ’21. Enough said on that matter which will likely go straight over your head….Deni, it’s my wish that you have a happy 62nd birthday with your family and friends close by for what ever celebration is in the offing.
Deni: for your information there was a Guy Richard Godden bn. UK 1946 who was sent to Tasmania in 1958 under the Bardado scheme aged 12. Guy went to school in Launceston and later became a bank Clerk. He was called up for national service in ’67, went to Vietnam with 3RAR in December ’67 and was subsequently killed in action during the ’68 Tet offensive at Long Dien Phuoc Tuy Province on 8/2/68. How do I know you might ask? Guy was my mate and I was close by when he fell still blazing away at God only knows what in the coconut trees above us. Could he have been your missing relative given up for adoption; so little is known about his antecedants back in England. His remains were RTA’d and Guy now rests in pace ( if he kniws what’s good for him) at Carr Rememerance Garden Launceston. An absolute legend in his time, such a waste and just 21. Lest We Forget.
Aunty Ailsa told me to come to this page because Alfred is having conniptions thinking he’s the late Somerton Man’s biological son. Apparently something about his massive… cymba got Ails thinking. And they are after the reward money because Morag’s Jag broke down, she’s been off work with Covid and the local mechanic – Ken – charges by the inch. The diner isn’t what it used to be since that old drunk took it over either. Anyway if you can provide some actual research for your assertions against Colonel Sanders it would really help a lot.
Prakash Goveni, the Beaumont childrens father, Grant “Jim” Beaumont, was not a taxi driver at the time the children went missing. He was a traveling linen salesman who had to hit the road, and his first stop after leaving the beach was Snowtown the day before the 26th, about 93 miles away from Adelaide.
He found no one there to pick up his goods so he came back home, arriving later in the day on the 26th January 66’…
Nice work sleuth!!
Thank you John but my full brother, named Colin Geoffrey Turner, which was my fathers surname and the name I was born with but never really used as my mum changed it when I was in Primary School to Hancock, was born in April 1951, but your mate sounded like a good bloke.
May he rest in Peace.
The two full brothers on either side of Colin were Lee and Barry respectively.
None of my brothers did National Service.
Have you ever seen the movie ‘Finding Nemo’ John?
What have we got here?
Bob knew Frank,
Frank knew Bill,
Bill and Frank knew Paul
Theres a monkey called Paul Frank
Paul Frank is a cartoon monkey
Bob’s children watched cartoons
Bill also knew Bob’s 4th cousin Jill,
Jill and Bill had been friends since kindergarten,
Bob’s ex-wife Evie was a hairdresser,
Evie is Frank’s 3rd cousin,
Bob’s brother Dan was a criminal,
Dan was Bob’s children’s uncle.
Prakash Goveni what’s you’re point?
Connect the dots with what? For what? What does connecting the dots solve?
Jacquie: Can’t say I have, must have come out during my prolonged abscence, although the name Nemo rings a bell. Something from star wars, right?
Thank you for the birthday wishes John, but you flatter me, you made me younger than I am, i’m 63 now!
An australia NZ wide search of all records for Jim’s mum Florence Muriel bn. 1893 and only sister Joyce Muriel bn. 1921; also witness? Jean Gladys Langley bn. 1923.(still living?) have had persistant negative results over many years.
Movie is called finding ‘Finding Nemo’ not Star Wars, so no.. probably not something from Star Wars haha. Nemo is a fish, it came out many, many years ago.
Inspector Gadget: think I mentioned the blue bathing togs with the white stripe some time ago. St. Peters college swim team wore them from the 30’s at least. I’m reminded that two brothers BMS and JCS had been top athletes when attending there in the 30s /40s era. It’s likely therefore they continued to wear their old school colours in later years, such was the St Peters old boys sense of loyalty. They just happen to be two of four key persons of interest for me, along with a sister JGL (still living?) and husband Max who passed in ’87 from memory.
It’s so obvious.
John Sanders is Joe Biden’s alias.
you’re random ramblings and constant attempts to speak with people who aren’t even there are a dead giveaway, clearly it’s you Joe Joe.
Don’t pretend like you didn’t try to shake hands with you’re laptop when I first commented- we all know you did.
Jacquie: should you find and glaring errors in my ramblings in my last long winded narrative, point them out and I’ll apologise to Inspector Gadget..If I owned a laptop I’d be all over the shop although I’d need lessons first, my big problem being what I term as being digitaly dislexic (my word).
Uh Joey?
I did that with you’re last Inspector Gadget comment, do you forget?
You didn’t apologise and you obviously didn’t learnt anything because you’re still continuing to repeat the same bad behaviour.
Does digital dyslexia mean that you’re unable to learn lessons through a digital device?
Jacquie: If you’re on the same whitiker/Mullins Satin Man wave length as Big Footy’s Senior list commenter ‘Tues’ , remind him to scan my previous David Smith posts on this thread vis-a-vis, his call NS call up in July 1965 not Feb ’66, his long delayed short tour of duty in Vietnam ( a full 16 months after BC kid’s went missing), from May through December ’67 as a rear eschellon driver from my understanding, who may or may not have “witnessed the horrors of war” Suffice to say Dave Smith, was not in place to see the BC kids at Glenelg on Australia Day ’66 rendering his statement to police in 2015 a piece of pure fiction. NB I can’t confirm positively that DS didn’t get a deferment of his call up to 2nd intake but it is unlikely in view of his non fulltime student status; even if so, his claims to a complete ignorance of the case until 2015 can be seen for what it is, ridiculous in the extreme and unconscionable whatsmore.
Mr. Biden: I’m familiar with the name but unfortunately I am unable to assist you with that task-I don’t know them, sorry- you’ll have to pass you’re message on yourself or try asking someone else.
I have not read the book and nor do I have any intentions on doing so.. I have no interest in that theory whatsoever..
But, as for the book itself- Almost everyone I’ve ever spoken to who has read it, gives it a fantastic review: it’s supposed to be quiet a good read, well written and what not..
I’m a bit of a control freak Joe, I need to see things for myself before I even begin to accept something as true.. Will have a look & get back to you.
I haven’t read The Satin Man book either nor will I be, and the new one coming out I won’t be reading either.
If I want to know about Phipps i’ll just go to the Facebook page on the subject!
John I have to say I agree with you on one point, I do not believe that David Smith witnessed anything, and if Brian Littely is in here you can take that to the bank, for what it’s worth..
His 23 second video said nothing, he looked like a scared little lamb with Brian putting words in his mouth.
I also find it very distasteful that Brian took Davids war medals after he passed away, he said he was gifted them but if he had any conscious he would have hunted down Davids son, estranged or not, and given them to him!!
I forgot to mention that ‘Tues’ does not believe David Smith either, she says that he was ‘invented’ by Brian L, among other things her and I have discussed over the last four or so years we’ve known each other online!
And could you please stop replying to the messages on that forum in here, it’s two different places and those people don’t have a right of reply if they are not members here. I’m sure you’ll say that they should join, but for most of them that wouldn’t be an option simply because of………….well you work it out!
Why don’t you join over there instead, join the Rookie Dusty, you may have something in common..
This thread is absolutely horrible and the majority of the people that contribute to it are sick in the head. No disrespect intended to the author.
Deni: joining some sort of fraternal order does not happen on this site, it being a free and open forum for all to express their genuine inner feelings, but with some taboos ie., not subjecting folks to repititious off subject clutter ad in finitum. I don’t see a problem with my reporting on what’s making news elswhere, nor in tempting new punters over to see how business is done here. Not withstanding, there being only two chances of having my personal BC contentions aired on a site such as Big Footy…Buckley’s and none…. PS: your Dusty 17 seems destined for greatness with an alias & number to boot; why didn’t I think of that over at Kyle’s place.
Thank you Glen, I agree and i’m backing out…….Again!
Glen: by not naming names, you get off Scott free.
A’hoy Captain Jon: Are you able to provide a link- source or other such documentation? (relating to call up in 65’)
Jacquie: If’n you be referring to moi, your wish is my command; But you’ll have to do Dave by his DOB (2/5/45) and ballot date range which corresponds to his NS notice for call up in July or August of ’65 from memory. Also validate his Vietnam service dates while your at it (19/5/67 to 6/12/67) to affirm my numerous post claims. Should you have difficulty with the simple on line research tables of Australia National Service intakes 1965 to 1971, give us a hoy and I’ll fill you in.
Vietnam War Service
Name SMITH, David Ridley
Service Australian Army
Service Number 4718053
Date of Birth 02 May 1945
Place of Birth FYZABAD, INDIA
Rank Private
National Service Yes
Corps Royal Australian Infantry Corps
Honours None for display
Unit Name 2nd Battalion, The Royal Australian Regiment
Start Date 19 May 1967
End Date 06 Dec 1967
Next of kin: Smith, Frederick
Migration to Aus 1950-1951
departing UK under the Assisted Passage Migration Scheme SMITH Frederick Charles born 7 December 1906
Alice Elizabeth (nee Ridley) born 29 May 1912
Frederick Charles born 9 March 1940
David Ridley born 2 May 1945
Jill born 30 November 1936
You might be biting off a bit more than you can chew -keep up that condescending, superior attitude of yours.
I asked you to provide a link-either the source or provide the documentation of where you acquired the relevant information. I ask you again.
We’re discussing information relevant to the abduction and potential murder of 3 children (all under the age of 10) and you’re purportedly claiming to have evidence that can disprove an alleged eyewitness’ account..
Why the f aren’t you coming to the table?
Jacquie: what’s the point, we’ve been through Dave’s war service and it speaks for itself. Points to a tall tale by a troubled man spinning his own web of deceit (like so many) but who had passed before being found out ironically. End of the day Smithy’s perjured testimony to Sapol don’t mean jack shit to me or to this thread’s successful quest for answers, maybe you might think about getting involved, on second thoughts don’t trouble yourself, it’s too late.
…”disproving an alleged witness account” Jacquie you can do better surely. If you wish to discuss abduction and potential murder of three children (Beaumont’s?) (all under the age of ten), then by all means do so, or better still go a site where such theories are more in vogue. PS If you wish, new kid on the block Glen who comes with some history might like to be your friend.
Excuses.
You’re going a very long way around not answering the question.
A fanciful interpretation of the facts hardly forfeits you of the obligation you have to put your money where your mouth.
Evidence, now.
You do realise that absolutely everybody reading at this point has already begun questioning weather or not you have any evidence at all?
Myself included- are now starting to think you might be making things up? What else might you have made up? Everything quickly becomes up from grabs, doesn’t it?
Surely not? – you called out a successfully published author and you also individually singled out and named another person who appears to not even be on this thread at all? – and you expect me to believe that you did that based on what?-lies? -that you made up? Nah…there’s no way -you couldn’t be that foolish, could you?
Jacquie: I was about to suggest that you make like the proverbial ‘ little red hen’ and do it yourself but, cluck off might be more appropriate in your case!
In other words:
You’re upset with me because you chose to poke the bear with proverbial stick?
Jaqui,
During my time in Adelaide I actually had good reason to learn quite a bit about the Beaumont case – I was one of the investigators seconded in the 70s to work back through boxes of material. I can only tell you that during the period I was involved we ruled *nothing* out. John Sanders is also a credible individual who has done his own investigations in Vietnam
For anyone without a modicum of nouse or be otherwise incapable of finding out for themselves by other means, the amazing new online internet allows for easy access to information not previously available to the undereducated. Included are many government indices such as the Australian War Memorial which catalogues records on all manner of militaria past and present e.g. The Aust. National Service Scheme 1964-1972 has listings of the various induction ballots by order of intake, a quick example revealing that a chap, by the name of, say David Ridley Smith born on 2nd May 1965, unless granted exemption was required by law to present for two years of compulsary Army service in July/August of 1965 (date to be advised) ….”or else likely to be shot at dawn for failure to obey a lawful command”.
The wheel of fortune spins for all of us, Sanders. I invite you to recall that many Australians were able to bunk off the Nashos and particularly if they were in ‘good standing’. There’s a reason why Max McIntyre and his abusive scout master boyfriend were able to avoid military service – and Carl Webb would himself definitely not have been in a reserved occupation if he were an electrical fitter. He would have been needed on the ground at any of our Royal Australian Air Force bases here or in the old country. Any wizened old bat can make munitions.
John Burgess: there were plenty of jobs in Maribyrnong that didn’t involve (usually young, actually) women pouring explosives into canisters while trying to avoid blowing themselves and their hut into a million pieces, all for a few extra shillings of danger money each week.
Adriana xenidez: a real pleasure indeed, someone at least familiar with detectives involved back in the day if we include possible links to the 1973 Adelaide Oval tragedy. In the mid 70’s I was debriefed by then case officer ‘killer’ Stan Swain who was on pre resignation leave and managed to gain a good insight into his non
shared views as to alternate possibilities that he was sadly not allowed to pursue. Whatever I’ve done since to procure answers in the BC case, has all been due to Stan’s shared insight and his daring to work outside the proverbial SQ box. Thanks for your confidence in my truth seeking bonifides, I will not change my style.
John Burgess: absolutely; but not necessarily exempted, for the ballot system was seen as bring fair to all be they rich or poor. What did occur in the case of sports stars and sons of the influential and affluent, notable exceptions notwithstanding, is that they were allowed to do their time in units not destined for Vietnam, or else served in overseas holiday postings where some destined for greatness actually learnt the art of soldiering which they carried over to civilian life. I was neither here nor there, having joined at 17 and sailed away on the Sydney out of Adelaide a year later. So happens it was the day PM Harold Halt disappeared and the day before I turned 19.
Adriana – Sorry, I’m unfamiliar-what does ‘seconding’ the case mean? It’s not a phrase I’ve ever heard a senior detective use before in regards to a case.
“John Sanders has done investigations in Vietnam? “ I’m guessing you missed a couple words or something because otherwise I’m not sure what the relevance is.
As a senior investigator, Adriana, or as a game show hostess (who sadly passed away in 2010) I’m sure you would already be well aware of what a catfish is.
Jacquie: look again and you may note ‘seconding’ is not the word (phrase?) Adriana used; seems your slip is showing once again. Seconded be the word that she used, and most appropriately at that. My little book of words suggests a temporary re assignment to another section which fits in with her job of checking through boxes of material relating to the Beaumont investigation. Simple explanation really but in your way above capacity to fathom. Sorry to be so blunt old thing but if the cap fits….
You’re kidding, right?
That’s what you’re going to try and come at me with?
My gigantic misrepresentation of the facts? – having used the present participle for ‘second’ instead of using the past tense.
Get a grip, you’re embarrassing yourself.
You’ve even gone and screwed yourself over with your own ‘cap fitting’ business.
“If the cap fits” that’s right, Captain “IF” I’m the wretched old hag barely into my thirties, how old you?
Peter Davidson: on your Geni Beaumont family chart, you have Jim’s mother Florence Muriel bn. 1893 with no death date and sister Joyce muriel bn. 1921 swith a death date of 26th January 1966. If I’m not mistaken the year entry was taken from the MyHeritage site and the ominous Australia Day date added for good measure to link it with the alleged abductions. I’d be pleased if you could elaborate and/or update the data but, speak in whispers, we wouldn’t want to upset the ‘negatives’.
How lovely of you to stop by John, long time – no see. Sounds like you haven’t been doing much research at all, have you? good for you!
I suspect Peter Davidson or whomever it is that created this tree has just done what most people do when they are trying to collect any genealogical information (assume that they can trust the information they find provided on sites such as MyHeritage, Ancestry ect..) the problem is people make mistakes, or basically just will put whatever they want in there and unfortunately since all the sites can be linked as the “source” for the information, if it is wrong- then that mistake just continues to get replicated over and over again with everyone who connects it.
Luckily, I assume I’m probably one of these so called ‘negatives’ that you speak of;
Perhaps that’s why I on the other-hand, as opposed to you Mr.Positive, am more than willingly to be forthcoming with corroborating evidence to support my claims.
Back to your original question John..
BEAUMONT, Joyce Enid
D.O.B: 2 JAN 1939
Father: William Ernest Cyril BEAUMONT
Mother: Florence Lydia BEAUMONT
Source 1: (Education Enrolment)
(1944, Verdun, South Australia, Australia)
Collection: Australia, South Australia, School Admission Registers, 1873-1985)
Hope that helps.
Team negative- 1 / Team positive-0
✌️
wacky Jacquie: wrong middle names with wrong dobs and wrong familial connections. Worse than PeteDavo @ Redacted’s geniological gaffs or, is that merely your sickish humour re our missing Beaumont kids’ grand mum and aunt.
My mother was born in 1924, her birth name was Gladys Aileen Godden. Through her teen age years she hated that name, but she kept it into her first marriage. When her husband was declared M.I.A. she remarried and changed her name completely, she became Jane Eileen Turner, but nobody knew, she’s even on my oldest brother in Australia’s birth certificate as Jane, but on my older brother from her first marriage she’s Gladys…
Once we moved to Australia her whole family searched for her, even her oldest son in England spent a lot of money trying to find her but because she had changed her name she was lost to everyone..
My point to that is anyone can change their first, middle, or surname, especially back then when it was much easier and friends and family would be none the wiser..
As for their date of birth, my mum put herself down as 10 years younger than she actually was!!
Deni: up until March 1947, Joyce Muriel Beaumont who was then aged 26 and unmarried, retained her birth name, as did her mother Florence right up until she disappeared from records in 1958 aged 65. I’ll certainly concede that people are inclined to adjust their monikers for various reasons eg. Jim was born Grant and his mum was known as Flora, neither of whom altered their dates of birth as far as I know. Another original police witnes Jean Langley, aged 40 in 1966, missing since 1978, was known to her Glenelg cronies as Jenny, and so whilst in essence I can see your point, I doubt that any òf the aforementioned would fit that category.
The only thing I know for sure is that she didn’t go on to pursue a career as a professional hockey player- I’d know if she did, I’m an expert in case you didn’t know John 😉
On a seperate note, I may have found something (There’s a marriage record between a John Walters and a “Joyce (restricted access)” inn 1946. I did not include any first or second name when doing this search, search was done only using the last name BEAUMONT. – so I can only assume that whilst the access may be restricted, since the last name is still technically on file (the fact that it’s restricted likely doesn’t omit it from the search results) just a flaw in their privacy system)
It may be a different Joyce Beaumont in any case, but figure it probably warrants further investigation.. I’m just lacking in motivation to do it right now haha
John Sanders: thanks for your most recent comment on the Webb/Lockyer thread which led me to here. Boy have I got some catching up to do as the Beaumonts are my favourite topic apart from JFKs head wound. I’m looking forward to more instalments here.
Looking at the family tree at the start of this thread, it is worth noting that my best mate’s wife’s second cousin’s cat is also my cat. On first glance that is a pretty big disconnect between Max B and Prosper T.
Lurch: afraid I’m not in a position to help you with your cat, never having owned one although I’m neither for nor agin cat people in general. I have a feeling that Peter Davidson might be able to assist in matters of felix genealogy if a pedegree is in doubt, so long as appropriate paperwork and DNA typing can be accessed. With regard to your other topic of interest apart from JFK’s tragic death, suggest you go to Big Footy BC forum who are more than happy to hear from folks with a theory worth exploiting.
John S: I’ve actually been to check out Dealey Plaza. No conspiracies from me, I could’ve made LHO’s shot, although I’m not sure he was going for Kennedy. Anyhow I digressed, no genealogy needed on the cat. Pretty sure it’s wild. But I would have to say that being Jim’s first cousin once removed’s brother in-law is pretty distant, almost not connected. Thinking out aloud here but I don’t think I would know my first cousin once removed’s brother in-law.
Welcome back home Melissa Highsmith after 51 years living as Melanie Brown and with your loving family never giving up hope of being reunited one fine day.
Had it not been for the persistance and never say die efforts of but a few good people often denounced as cruel hoaxers and cranks ever since the day of her abduction in 1971, this could not have been possible.
57 years have come and gone since that day of days and yet I remain hopeful for a better outcome than most can foresee. Meanwhile Jim Beaumont just turned 98 and I guess he’ll be thinking of Jane, Arnna and young Grant too. As for brother Max, at last his service record is digitalised and can be viewed on NAA with a 1/47 inlistment photo and at last his stated date of birth 15/3/28.
…..I couldn’t help but notice uncanny similarities in facial features of eighteen year old Maxwell Beamont in 1947, compared with those of two sketches of the man seen frollicking with the kids in vicinity of Pier Hotel on Australia Day 1966, bearing in mind that Max was himself 38 and living not so far away at that time.
Wondering if any of our facial recognition folk might like to attempt a comparison between Max Beaumont and the ‘suspect’ sketches from 1966. I would not be at all surprised if a high range match could be obtained even without using some form of aging advancement process app.
The major mysteries of the Beaumont children case are that three children were apparently abducted by a lone man, and it was claimed that the children were “stranger aware” even by the standards of the day and would not have gone off with a stranger. I previously noted May 22nd 2016 that Maxwell John Beaumont was the uncle of the Beaumont children. He also worked as a taxi driver in the Glenelg area.
“Maxwell John Beaumont (13) summons, indecently assaulting Dorothy Jean Hayward aged 16 years & 8 months; custody and control of Children’s Welfare Dept. until 18 years of age. Consts. Mensforth and Northwood. J.C. Adelaide 7/8/45 (C11096).” South Australian Police Gazette. September 5th 1945 page 317.
John Sanders (?) previously noted that Maxwell was immediately transferred from custody of the Children’s Welfare Department to the Australian Army supposedly at age 13!. It is clear that Max’s age was misrepresented to the sentencing authorities (the Police Gazette has Max’s age as 13 whereas he was actually aged 17). So, it is clear that strings were pulled to have Maxwell dealt with as a minor.
Were SAPOL aware at the time of the abductions that Max was a convicted child sex offender? Did SAPOL ever check this obvious line of inquiry?
John, if, as you say, it might have been Max that took the children, would he have taken them for his sick deeds or would he have taken them on Nancy’s instruction that they get given to family friends to bring up as their own..
But that wouldn’t make sense because one of the reasons you came up with about Nancy sending the kids away was because of uncle Max?
Serious question by the way, I just want to hear your opinion on it..
Actually the photo is pretty good John, it’s 8 times the magnification though, so once you save the image , crop it down so it’s just Max then make it 8 times bigger and it’s clear..
If that makes sense..
Byron: Surely Max Beaumont’s preditorial history as a juvenile? has been the subject of backgrounding by Sapol, although to what extent we’re not to know. By now you would have seen his digitalised service file and noted how close his features resemble those of the all too familiar “suspect” sketches. Of course he’s long dead now so can’t be of any use in accounting for his movements for the time. On another most crucial aspect of the case, I suggest you read my posts of 9, 10, 11November ’21 and help locate subject Jean Gladys Langley nee Snoswell bn.1926. She and husband Maxwell Thomas Langley bn. 1923 dec. ’87 knew the Beamonts (see caravan holiday pic.) while still living in Diagonal Road, along the kid’s bus route to Glenelg. If ‘Jenny’ is still with us she’d be 96/7 but, if still mentally alert, I feel she may have recollection of the of the events of the day not previously disclosed. My efforts to track her down have encompased all trace avenues known to most search indices, so you you’ll have to dig deep.
Actually, could anybody get anything right in those days..
On his proceedings for discharge form it has his date of birth as 15/3/31..
15/3/28 has been scribbled out..
@Deni…in re your 3.14am comment/query of 27th inst. o ‘Max as suspect’. If you can provide a CM comment reference number or time and date for the quote, I’ll check my records and consider an appropriate response in line with new rules of engagement.
Max was a known sexual predator. Connected by marriage to Jestyn. There wasn’t a boy or girl alive he refused to diddle – anything was possible for MB. He was close friends with Prosper during the time both were taxi drivers and he regularly trafficked kids in his cab. I know who owns such a cab, which is a yellow Ford Zephyr.
Max B terrorised his sister in law and ruined her life.
Kara: I think we can agree that the familial connections between the Harkness and Beaumont families are at best tenuous and in my opinion hardly worth a separate
thread, let alone a fancy family tree chart though, if not for it we wouldn’t have had any opportunity to cover the 1966 abduction case to the extent we have, so thanks NP for small mercies. In spite of what some might infer I really haven’t formed any opinion as to Max Beaumont’s likely participation, but to say that from his history and being well known to the victims, he can’t be ovelooked as a person of interest. As for connections between Max and Prosper, by virtue of both having been taxi drivers, that is only specultion; in fact the latter operated hirer cars for intra state travel and not suburban taxis as Max did, to best of my knowledge. I’ve been able to gather a deal of history on the man including at least five different vocations, a similar number of residential moves, two marriages and at least three children, plus two mundane procedural contacts with police in S.A. & ACT between 1949 and 1975 up until his death in 1992. If you can provide more in depth information on Max Beaumont or anything of relevance, I’ll certainly give it consideration.
Kara If you know who owns the cab have you told major crime yet?
In fact have you spoken to anyone about this things you’ve written above?
In fact, where is the proof/link to what you have said?
John It wasn’t 3.14am that I sent it, you can rest assured that I was sleeping rather peacefully at that time. Maybe that was the time Nick approved it.
I am not going over an hours worth of reading just to find the one post from you to this group.
I just know you said something along the lines of Nancy didn’t trust Max, it wasn’t on BF, so it must have been here.
My apologies if i’m wrong!
Byron: it wasn’t me that advised on Max having gone into the army directly from child welfare custody at 18. In fact I’ve always had doubts about Jim’s brother having been the juvenile offender Maxwell John Beaumont referred to in the ’45 Police Gazette or the 1954 divorce petition we’re familiar with. Of course he most certainly drove the Taxi involved in collision with a fuel tanker in 1950 as well as being charged with assault in Canberra many years later. To support this point of view our Max was never known to use the middle monicker ‘John’ that I’m aware of and in his inlistment as just Maxwell gave his employment as ‘press hand’. There happened to be a plumber with the add on ‘John’, born in 1930 knocking around Adelaide in the 60s who was not heard from after about 1970 and “we don’t know where he are”. I’d be happy to hear from you or anyone else on this or any other aspect of the case in need of clarification.
Deni: exactly as I expected from you and not good enough by far. Know why? Because I never said anything about “Nancy not trusting Max” they’re your words not mine. I don’t need your apologies now or ever just for you to cease and desist as do most others here at CM, I’m betting.
There is the real Johnny that we all love to hate!
Cease and desist I will, I didn’t think you could hold a conversation without it dripping with sarcasm.
And for the record, I have had messages sent to me by members in here to the BF forum and they are not so kind in your assumption of you being a nice person!!
Deni: no sweat mate, if you get yourself a new broom and another cat it should keep you in touch with any new high flying Satin Man developments. Say hello to Jacquie.
In Deni’s even dated post on Big Footy’s ‘Satin Man’ website which includes an attempt at a Max Beaumont, Sapol POI sketch comparison, she provides brief details of a “minor” sexual assault on a sixteen year old girl in 1945. In my own related post of 29 Jan., I made specific mention to having grave doubts of said offender having been Jim Beaumont’s young brother, but more likely a local plumber? with like name birth details.. Should Max Beaumont’s innocence be established beyond doubt, such grave injustice to the man’s memory and to his family must be formally addressed.
Maxwell John Beaumont lived in suburban Adelaide until his recent passing and seemingly without coming under notice subsequent to his juvenile sexual assault charge in 1945. Apart from being married, with four children, one an adoptee, he little else is known of him although he was possibly a plumber. It seems that Max had some dealings with a Czech national, who had done time for stealing within months of his arrival in 1949. This multi offender may himself have been known to Max Langley of Somerton, Jean Snoswell’s husband, as is evidenced by mutual visits to PNG in January 1972 which is unlikely to have been coincidental imo.
Byron Deveson: I think you might agree that your Maxwell John Beaumont is not Jim’s brother Max who did a short stint in the Army in 1947 prior to Jim’s return from Japan. The other man had continued residency in S.A. until his death in 2018 and worked as a plumber from at least 1954 to ’79; Max sans John had moved to Canberra with his wife Una Doris and kids prior to the abductions in 1966 and so remained at Deakin then Evatt until his own demise in 1992. I’d be pleased if you might affirm this change for the record, this being in order to defray any further attempts by Deni of Big Footy to convince her followers that Jim’s brother Max is one and the same with Maxwell John Beaumont of the 1945 Sapol Gazette.
As anticipated delightful ‘Deni’ is making moves to get the Big Footy team to take the bait apropos Jim Beaumont’s brother Max being the new person of interest. This being based on disproven sexual assault charges, along with a flawed confusing and incomplete Beaumont family ‘Geni’ entry that has Jim’s siblings Max & Joyce’s death dates occurring synchronically with the children’s disappearance, circa. 26 January 1966…
Nah Johnny, no one basically listened to me, which is cool.
They have more important things to discuss than what little ol’ me posts.
But I did get a lot of messages there en masse, asking me for information about Max Beaumont, they were interested in my theory but didn’t want to say in group in case it was all wrong.
I can understand that, iv’e been the same in the past.
We were also talking about the little old lady that had a suitcase full of the Beaumonts news items.
That was interesting, but again, they messaged me instead of asking about it online.
Unlike you I don’t mind being corrected, it educates me and it’s done in a way that it sounds helpful not nasty or vindictive!!
Deni: if it gives you some degree of satisfaction, no one has ever listened to me either. My satisfaction comes from belief that I’ve solved the case with no help, albeit with much hinderance, on my own terms terms and with a most desireable outcome achieved whatsmore. No longer any need to names is there?
And this little dig:
“Deni: no sweat mate, if you get yourself a new broom and another cat it should keep you in touch with any new high flying Satin Man developments. Say hello to Jacquie.”
That was just cruel, our cat meant the world to us and her dying was heartbreaking for both of us!
That’s devious Deni for you; got to give the girl points for audacity. Comes over here claiming that her colleagues are not giving her the attention she deserves. Then reports to Curve at Big Tooty command and goes back to being nasty and vindictive towards “the old fool” as expected.
No one ever listened to Ruth Collins either … much to her detriment.
Not til she metamorphosised into Xlamb and became household name… but nothing lasts forever.
Neither will you digger, no matter how hard you try.
Shout at the devil Deni. Don’t mean nuthin when you’re dealing with a she cat.
Peteb: just in time, Deni is in need of a few home truths from her hero. You a cat lover by any chance?
That is true, no longer any need to name names, I took the post down after it was explained to me that I shouldn’t use others names that weren’t members over there, or weren’t involved personally with the crime mentioned..
But not before someone had quoted me, so your name still shines for anyone to see, but I must ask them to remove it..
But surely you would know after all of these other people here and there don’t believe in your theories that you could be wrong?
Heavens to murgatroyd, that can’t be true…..Can it!
And this little dig:
“Deni: sorry that you find me so repulsive my sweet, rest assured you’re not alone, even me old old minx cat cringes when I pass her box. Just can’t help being mean love of my life!”
You admit to being mean, why would a man of your age do that, I just don’t get it, the only one getting satisfaction from your posts is you, most people just bypass them..
Anyway, as much as iv’e disliked our little tête-à-têtes, and I say that because sometimes I felt you were just writing to me, I must dismiss your ‘love of my life’ comment as you being on the sauce last night.
I have in fact got a partner, i’ve had him for the last 22 years, we’ve just about surpassed my marriage, which was exactly to the day 22 years before, and we’re still very happy together!!
And for the record, I don’t find you repulsive at all, I feel sorry for you..
Deni : thats ok me luv. One thing that got me miffed though, was your obvious mis understanding when I urged you to go out and buy a new broom and get yourself another cat. I could have put it another way eg., dry the tears and start over or, even better, don’t cry over spilt milk, simply mop up the mess and pour another glass. There does come a time when one must be cruel to be kind, so I’ll say it again; take my advice and get another cat. PS: a naughty kitty in a bleak house will let the sun shine in and make for a brighter days ahead, always worked in my pad: PPS: I ain’t wrong on BC and I don’t give two hoots whether I’m believed or nay.
Curve (BF),
A quick search of Sands & Mc. records reveals that Deni is mistaken in her claims to having lived/stayed with her mom in flats opposite Wenzel’s bakery when the Beaumont kids were reported missing 26/1/ 66. Despite evidence to the contrary, Deni refuses to acknowledge that Wenzels was located at 2 Moseley St. on Jetty Rd. corner, (opposite Dorack flats), arguing that the store was in fact further along Moseley St. directly across from Alexander flats (now backpackers) which she may be confusing with the long gone Dorack apartments. S&Mc 1963/73 will prove my own assertion beyond doubt to anyone wishing to get to the heart of the matter. As for Deni’s claim to being on or near Glenelg beach that very same day as a five or six year old, speaks volumes for her impressive powers of early childhood recall if that be true, expecially in connection to something that should not have jogged her memory half a century or more later.
Your defamatory remarks re my alleged harmful comments vis-a-vis “JS…is very wrong causing great offence and upset to the family named” were uncalled for and defamatory. They having been in reply to Deni’s plea to have my name removed from the blog, and not such a wise choice of words as site Moderator, especially given your delay in doing so. The damage is now done and I’ll pay a high price no doubt; though you may limit its extent by at least removing your own defamatory remarks. Such action if taken soonest, might serve to avoid any repercussions or consequences arising therefrom…ps. I know you follow this blog so a promt reply is eagerly anticipated, cordially yours, js
A little backtracking is in order concerning two other long missing Beaumonts. namely the BC’s grandmother Florence Muriel and their maiden aunt Joyce Muriel. They were known to be living at the family home in Jocylin circa.1958 then disappeared without trace, leastwise with regard to my own unsuccessful efforts to trace their subsequent whereabouts. Somewhat strangely, it seems that Jim’s wife Nancy Ellis @ Mrs. G. A. Beaumont became the new occupant, that is until the house changed hands in 1960 with Jim and family moving to their new home at Harding St. Somerton. Florence had been born Winter to an itinerant family moving between Qld & S.A. and she had two younger brothers Alfred George and Donald William who died aged 72. Don can be seen from his Army file as being a rather diminutive though tough looking fellow, who was a stockman before heading north in 1939 to join up; his inlistment dossier is in my possession courtesy of 2/3 Fld. Regt Association…Cut to the quick, I need to know what became of Florence and Joyce Beaumont post 1958 and any genuine help on offer would be much appreiated. Thanks js
Byron Deversion: your unintentionally flawed information regarding the kid’s uncle Max Beaumont’s alleged sexual assault upon a fifteen year old in 1945 was most unfortunate in that it has resulted in a time consuming need for full re appraisal to sort fact from fiction. It has since been established that the fifteen year old victim Dorothy Jean Hayward had been an orphan when the offence was committed, her dad Alan was an invalided Gallipoli veteran who died in 1929 and her mum Mary passed when she was five. The culprit Maxwell JOHN Beaumont was apparently a ward of the state at the time, who appears to have become a plumber in later life and who died in 2018 from memory.
Peter Bowes: that’s correct 26 January 1966 was the actual date of the BC’s disappearance however, despite the timely removal of yesterday’s last post for amending of same, it seems your following post hasn’t done much better. This based on Anthony Allen [sic] Munro, the Adelaide based paedophile whom you assume to be dead. Well not so my man as of a week ago, unless Ruth Collins has provided a good news up date on the fellow’s welfare.
John Sanders … I’ve got a job going as replacement mother-in-law, the pay isn’t good, the hours are long and the liquor cabinet is always locked .. other than that you’re a walk in.
Does anyone know what the update on the Beaumont Children is?
On another forum Ruth Collins is now claiming to be Jane Beaumont herself and has finally broken her silence. Apparently the real Ruth Collins was murdered and chopped up by her father and buried in a well in Stansbury Peninsula. Jane speaks about how she worked as a prostitute in an Adelaide pub and was pimped out by Andrew McIntyre her assumed brother. It is well know that Ruth Collins and Andrew McIntyre had a child together called Jesse. At least with the truth coming out that Jane is actually Ruth it isn’t incest anymore.
GH: Pete Bowes is more than welcome to gorge himself on Ruth Collins’ smorgasbord of stories, I have no appetite for them here.
Pb: some information that maybe of help in your current investigations that be neither proof or nay of alleged past paediphile activities of Allan Maxwell McIntyre and Anthony Allan Munro. First afforementioned McIntyre was a 1981 recipient of the Australian National Medal for fifteen years plus of commendable community services and, his alleged young protoge Munro worked in Port Moresby during the late sixties and early seventies as an employee of Unilever Corporation Sydney.
I’m amazed that all the stories continue. People are really scraping around the barrel so to speak! 😂
Does anyone know what the situation was between Pete Bowes and the Mangnusson relative Chloe?. I read a thread on what Pete did to Chloe all those years ago. [Remainder of comment moderated out]
Nick Pelling: GH’s “on another forum Ruth Collins” intro reminds me of a certain someone who’s known to use that same refrain regularly when not having the gumption to name Cipher Mysteries and/or my monicker on her endless loop BC forum.
PB: unbeknowns to all the Keane punters including your good self, some years back Tomsbytwo posted an undated photo, perloined from Derek Abbott’s FB page entightled “Jestyn’s school days” and it came with a plea for help in identifying the school. It took me a New York minute to identify same as being Mordialloc College, Melbourne and despite the given time frame as being mid thirties, it was clearly 60s according to uniforms and hairstyles. Your decision to delete it was perhaps to avoid unwanted attention and therefore a wise move, though not before both BD, Misca and Clive Walker replied to my silly suggestion. Cut to the point mate, if you still have the snap, there be a young fellow in the frame that is readily identified as being Tbt’s current flavour of the month, Robyn McMahon Thomson and no bones about it!
Robyn ?
Pete: Just a heads up that you and Ruth Collins home addresses have been published on multiple forums and websites. I just thought I would bring it to your attention as you frequent this site regularly.
Allen?
GH, some years ago an inventive but unprepared troll happened across the farm I once lived in .. and after climbing the gate was surprised to find he was about to be engaged with a couple of my cross-bred Alsatian and American pit bull terriers, the carnage was hard to watch, his pathetic howls for mercy lost in the eternal stillness of the hinterland hills. Luckily we were able to drown out his noise with one of Phillip Glass’s recent operas. Superlative stuff, full of drama, recommended.
We buried what was left of the dismembered troll the following day, an arm here, an ankle there, a mess of grey matter that may have once been protected by his skull. Oddly enough his lips were spared destruction and were empaled, strangely, on an old Durobby tree once used by Aboriginal women as a shelter from the occasional cyclones that wander through this part of the world.
What I’m saying old fruit, is that you may have entranced Dome with your unimaginative rubbish .. but in me both of you have met your master. So face it mate, you are an exceptional dill.
False Memory Syndrome ?
Then you should seek help, there are facilities for such an impairment.
Anyone can toss poisoned meat at the dogs. Perhaps you should have kept the fact you have guards dogs to yourself. You have just opened you and your family up to greater danger.
P.S Pete
The Chloe Mangnusson stuff has been going around for years and wasn’t started by me. You must remember her talking about the photos you sent her or have you conveniently forgotten? [Remainder removed by moderator]
If you are aware of facilities for False Memory Syndrome you should direct this information to Ruth Collins. Lol
How is Nurse Collins these days Pete?
When Ruth pretended to be a nurse at the old people’s home Nancy Beaumont was residing in Nancy was having none of it and threw a bedside lamp at her. It clearly hasn’t knocked any sense into her.
Nick Pelling. I know where you live, I know where your children go to school. I know your daily movements. I have the ability to hack your computer. I am taking photos of you and your family on a 24 hour loop. I am able to break into your home whenever I please. Your life is mine. You are in danger.
How does it feel, Dome? What goes around comes around.
What’s more, Dome, I understand the great disappointment you suffered when the Zodiac Cipher was decoded without your assistance, and by an Australian no less. This, together with your lifelong and unsuccessful attempt to decipher the Voynich Manuscript have soured your opinion of those you consider less than able to understand the understanding of matters you yourself have failed to understand .. a self-encirclement predicament I would not wish on my worst enemy.
Peteb: it feels like you’re trying to get arrested for stalking. Good luck with that, I guess.
Peteb: the Zodiac Killer Cipher was decrypted by a team of people, all three of whom contributed to the effort in their own way. Perhaps there’s a bigger lesson to be had there that isn’t about passports.
Wow Pete! You truly are a Psycho.
I hope your okay Nick
Pete is really showing his true character by going on about Schoolchildren.
😱
NickPete
This latest fallout comes as no real shock but is sad nonetheless, especially in that my feelings for you both knows no bounds. You’re like a pair of ‘muthers’ by my estimation, of that there can be little doubt. In that vein, if the pair of you can agree for once, I’ll consider it an honour to further fan the flames of your mutual ire and agree to undertake the melancholy duty without fear or favour Swelp me Jim.
Smart-arse
Holy shit ! when the Colonel is the voice of reason you start to wonder wether you’ve just awoken from a very long coma.
The new “no personal attacks” comment policy is working well…
Tavi: though it’s still definitely an improvement on what was going on before, my will to moderate with an iron fist has been somewhat sapped of late.
Ahhhh what the f is happening?
Grant Alfred (Jim) Beaumont, husband of Nancy, father of Jane, Arnna and Grant passed on Sunday last aged 97. Requiescat In Pace old digger.
….my calculations based on service records, give Jim’s age as 98 and not 97 as has been reported by The Advertiser and other independent sources. Seems they can’t even get a proud old soldier’s man’s age right when he falls off the perch.
Grant Beaumont has died, aged 97.
So many years of pain and anguish, we can barely imagine.
https://amp.abc.net.au/article/102227350
Sad. Now we can have an open discussion about what really happened to the children, since all members of the family are dead.
RIP – Jim Beaumont
Thoughts go to his second wife and family.
I hope that his son and daughter get some answers during their lifetime on what happened to their older siblings.
Grant (Jim) was a gentleman who endured the unimaginable and soldiered on which a straight back. He always cut a strong figure in spite of the horrendous circumstances he found himself in. The fact he lived into his late 90s is testament to his true strength and resilience. A great example of the Australian father figure of a different era.
RIP old digger. Forever respected.
Jim Beaumont was, according to both birth and service records, was born in Adelaide 3rd January 1925, which means he was 98 years 3months and six days of age when he passed on 9 April 2023. So what gives with information from news services etc. giving 97 as Jim’s age. I think it’s now quite appropriate for seeking many answers that have up until now been stiffled in the interests of discretion. A good place to start would be where did the name ‘Jim’ come from when was named Grant Alfred after his father and his uncle Alfred, there being no Jim or james in the family line that I can find. Of course there is also a need to ascertain what ever became of Jim’s mother Florence (Winter) and spinster sister Joyce, not heard of since vacating the Beaumont family home at Jocelyn in 1959; occupancy then taken over by his wife of four years Nancy. Also missing from shortly after the abduction date (according to Nancy) was her friend (my take) Jean (see July 65 caravan pic) who with husband Max Langley, vactated their Diagonal Rd. home (near Harding St. & the bus stop) and next re surfaced a year or two later at a new Somerton Park address where she remained at least until 1982 when Max passed. Jean Gladys Langley, who was still living in 2017, so would now be 95/96, is at least knowingly concerned with events of Australia day 1966 and her being called to witness is paramount to solving the case. There are more pertinent questions that remain unanswered including the mystery of Jim’s brother Max Beaumont’s being falsely accused of childhood sex offences; but they may be put on hold for now to see what the ghouls have to say when they come out to play OK?
He did not remarry.
Furthermore, ‘the abductor’ was seen leaving with the children to the change sheds. These were and are a homosexual beat. Anthony Munro was a homosexual predator who seduced young boys at the same sheds. Assuming Mullins is correct and the Satin Man Phipps was the abductor who led the children to the change sheds then that puts Munro in the frame with the Satin Man and establishes a link. Homosexual beats or cottages are regularly frequented by the same groups of people on a daily basis. This is why they are now fitted with NPR to fine habitual loiterers. Munro was at the beach every day. Satin Man Phipps was too. So take your pic as to who did want but that’s a pair of prime paedos right there. Before the new sheds went up the place was absolutely rotten.
GH
RIP – to decency and respect
My thoughts go to Jim’s niece and family.
I hope that your son and daughter get some answers during their lifetime on what happened.
Actually Jims Daughter and family.
Jim Divorced Nancy in 1970 and remarried a few years later. He had another daughter and then a son. His second wife sadly passed away. He lived in a flat in Glenelg in his final year and was visited by his daughter daily. I know for a fact that Jim and his second wife worked heavily with an organisation supporting the homeless and distributing food vouchers and support to people in need. Jim was a really nice man considering the heartache and trauma he’s been through. Let him rest in peace.
Well, the gloves are off now Sanders. You say that Beaumont friends or rellies abducted the kids and raised them as the Snoswells. Put your money where your giant gob is. Nobody left to sue you bar the three individuals you can prove are Nancy’s and Jim’s!
Actually I don’t disbelieve you… necessarily. The fact that the kids were seen with the strapper, some bloke and an old cow in a patterned dress certainly doesn’t negate your theory.
Snoswell’s bum chin doesn’t though.
I actually went to school with one of Jim’s later kids / Nephew ???? (Confused by other readers comments!)
Nancy was also a dinner lady at the school but Jim’s children changed schools because of her presence being there. I know quite a lot about the Beaumont’s first hand because I’ve met them all through the church. I know that Jim and Nancy’s marriage would have ended in Divorce if the children weren’t abducted. There were serious marital problems and the cause was on Nancy’s part. There have always been rumours that Nancy was pregnant with Jane when she met Jim and he took Jane on as his own or something like that. It might have been that Nancy was a single mum with Jane when she met Jim. The other two children from his marriage to Nancy were definitely his.
Minstrel Janet
I’m struggling to find anything that relates to your stating that ‘the abductor’ “was seen leaving with the children for the change sheds”. Athough I can’t say that I’ve read Stuart Mullins’ version of events which, if true, go contrary to the accepted police version which has the kids remaining in the park presumably awaiting his return. Sorry for having to repeat these details but, the facts as reported, must stand until you can produce evidence to confirm otherwise. We really must not let Jim’s sad departure turn this case into an ‘endless loop’ of repetitious conjecture and inuendo that we’ve been subjected to elsewhere almost since time immemorial, so it would seem.
Hi John I’ve just seen your post about dates and people associated with the Beaumont family. Most of these people had joined the Family Cult headed by Anne Hamilton-Byrne. The cult had a policy of “Unseen, Unheard and Unknown”. So they wouldn’t have put themselves on official records so they wouldn’t be detected.
Minstrel Janet
Actually Janet, I don’t have to put my money anywhere, especially in my mouth, nor do I have anything more to prove to complete my most enduring case. All that has been in the hands of those entrusted with the investigation since I submitted it for their pleasure in 2020. They can decide what needs to be done Including of course payment of the reward which I surely deserve in expences and time alone not to mention providing a means to the best possible outcome which will be icing on the cake.
@Nick, it seems Dame Minstrel’s name contains a link to a dodgy adult site. I accidentally clicked it and got a rude shock…
I’m sorry GH (Glory Hole?) what on God’s green Earth? Jim did not marry again and did not have other children. We do not have ‘dinner ladies’ in Australia and if we did, at what schools were they present? Mrs Beaumont spent most of her forties and fifties in pubs around Somerton drinking shandies and weeping. That’s why Jim had to leg it. And can you blame her?
As for you, Private Slanders (not happy i mentioned the Snoswells then?) it was reported that after the man dressed the children by the seating & they followed him to the changing sheds in Colley Reserve. I wouldn’t expect you to be across any of the details since you appear to be like my first form Italian teacher whose sole mystique was his ability to talk in total cunting bullshit riddles – and who failed to teach any of us Italian.
Matt: I’m sure that will make the Minstrel’s day, though perhaps not yours. If anyone else wants the job of moderating CM, feel free to step forward? So… no takers, then?
Lol to cunting bulshit riddles…Good way to describe gas lighting
So what did we know about this guy Harry Phipps, and how would all this connect to the SM apart from the pasty….was there a know pastygate pedofile ring in Adelaide operating from the bakery supplying a cult with children. Could that woman in blue be no other than the cult leader…..
I will put it into simpler terms…. Nancy helped out at the school I went to. Why the links to the porn sites Minstrel Janet? Very odd when people are having a discussion about a sensitive subject. Very sick on your part. In future I will not be responding to anything you write about even if you try to bait me.
Does anyone know anything about Anne Hamilton-Byrnes “Family” branch in South Australia?. I know one of her “Aunties” was called Barbara Hamilton. She facilitated the adoption of many children to Anne as she had access to Single unwed mothers in a facility she ran. Where does the name “Hamilton” even come from?. Anne Hamilton-Byrne was born “Evelyn Edwards”.
DJ: in that Jim had lived for years at 44 Broadway, over the way from a pub of the same name which Nancy was known to frequent for whatever reasons, be hardly breaking news, nor that Jim was a paid up member of SCMA and Radio Eye’s charitable arm, that can be researched at the NAA reference on three open accounts if you pay the fee. So what other non surprises do you have in store. Chances are none would be news to me. I just never felt that any of it would bring about early closure. Sorry to disappoint.
Barbara Hamilton was also a distributor for a pharmaceutical product called “Relaxa Tabs”. I have provided a link to the product:
https://ibb.co/vhDbhT2
Nancy Beaumont was taking them in the 1960s and suffered a complete nervous breakdown and ended up in Parkside Hospital in Adelaide. This all happened before the abduction. Divorce documents reveal lots about an individuals marriage and their state of mental health / Social History Background.
GH : sorry, I don’t open links sumitted by strangers. However you may perhaps be surprised to hear that Jim’s uncle Don Winter, on his mum Flo’s side, was a mate of me old dad during the war, initally with the Darwin Mobile Force (DX89) in 1939 thence GB, Greece & Crete, the Middle East and later in New Guinea (different units) through to ’44. So you could say I have a ligitimate connection to the Beaumonts of sorts. Can you improve on that?.
GH: you really wanna know whence the name Hamilton – &c. came about. Ask Ruth Collins over the pond at Tbt. She will gladly fill you in on that score if you’ve got the time to spare and more.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Family_(Australian_New_Age_group)
1960s: The Family begins recruiting members from patients at Newhaven Clinic and giving them LSD.
1961: Anne Hamilton-Byrne meets Raynor Johnson and they found The Family.
1964: Johnson buys land at Ferny Creek, Victoria and builds Santiniketan Lodge, which becomes the headquarters of The Family.
1965: Hamilton-Byrne marries South African naval officer Michael Riley, but the marriage does not last.
1968: Hamilton-Byrne begins adopting children along with her partner Bill. Both change their name to Hamilton-Byrne but do not marry at this stage.
1970s: Hamilton-Byrne buys Broom Farm in Langton Green, England and a property in the Catskills, New York near Muktananda’s ashram. She also marries Bill.
1983: Australian Federal police go to Kai Lama looking for missing girl Kim Halm.
1986: Newhaven closes and is later the subject of a lawsuit brought by relatives of deceased group members. Anne Hamilton-Byrne wins.
1987: Sarah Hamilton-Byrne is expelled by Anne and later talks to police, resulting in raid on Kai Lama. Children are taken away from the property.
1988: Seven female group members are gaoled for social security fraud.
1989: Victorian police establish Operation Forest to investigate The Family.
1990: Former group solicitor Peter Kibby starts cooperating with police and confesses to forging birth records on orders from Hamilton-Byrne. Former “auntie” Patricia McFarlane gives information to police about adoption scams.[30]
1993: Anne and Bill are arrested in the Catskills by the FBI after phone calls are traced to Australia.
1995: Sarah Hamilton-Byrne’s book Unseen Unheard Unknown is published by Penguin.
2001: Sarah Hamilton-Byrne visits Bill before he dies. Anne Hamilton-Byrne attends his funeral in her only public appearance since her conviction.[31]
2009: In a spirit of forgiveness, Sarah Hamilton-Byrne takes the initiative in seeing Anne at her compound in Olinda, Victoria.
2013: It is reported that Anne is close to death with dementia in a Melbourne nursing home, and that there is an internal power struggle over Anne’s successor as leader of the group.[32] In an interview with ABC Local Radio in Ballarat in response to these reports, Ben Shenton, who had been adopted by The Family at the age of eighteen months, said the group had become a “toothless tiger”.[33]
2014: Secret diaries of Raynor Johnson are released to the public that give an authoritative insiders view on how the group started, what its aim was, and how it grew.[34][35][36][37]
2016: The Family documentary is released at the Melbourne International Film Festival; it is produced by Anna Grieve and written, directed, and co-produced by Rosie Jones.[38]
2016: Sarah Hamilton-Byrne dies, aged 46.[39]
2019: Rosie Jones expanded three-episode miniseries, The Cult of the Family, is released in March.[40]
2019: Anne Hamilton-Byrne died at the age of 97 on 13 June.[2]
GH: thanks for your concern. I’d already read it on line (verbatum) and had recall from when ‘The Family’ was big news but, any possible connection to the Beaumont case was always going to be a tenuous affair for me despite some suggestion of a mildly cultist nature within some elements of two well regarded S.A based affiliated religious movements.
And what has any of that got to do with Somerton Man or the Beaumont murder victims, Glory?
Just a little tiny weeny piece of evidence – nae, even coincidence or mere speculation – would cause me to regard you as something slightly less of a joke.
So Jim hated his wife did he? Had to get the kids away? You believe this dog turd, Sergeant Stuffup?
You know the Snoswells would sue you for everything if you hadn’t already spunked it up a wall in Saigon. No use trying to extract blood from a stone. Or a rock head.
Like I said, lay out your magic carpets Sanders and Glory. Let’s see your shitty trinkets; just for the lulz.
Can’t top that Mr. Moderator, care to say a word or two in my defence, if there be any….Janet: if you’re looking for overlaps with BC and SM cases, I suggest you check CM’s two Dr. Doug Hendrickson threads for all the relevant details but, alas no recent updates, unless you think of some filth to cream your jeans over.
Deni Team Captain @ Big Footy
“There is a cretin by the initials JS on another forum who has put together a whole new story/family for them (?)..
It’s disgusting to read and more so for the family involved, and yes, it involved one of the parents (?)
And that’s enough airtime i’ll [sick] give this, the dead set dickhead is just
waiting on the reward now!! “.
You’re God damn right about one thing Deni…Cheers John Sanders
Big Footy Team Captain, Club Legends, Premiership Players, and all Stars are now recapitulating on whether their prime Suspect from the outset in 2012, Derek Percy, might well have been in Adelaide on Aust. Day 1966 at 16 years of age to carry out the oft cited crime of the century. Although initially thought to be acting alone, seems Kurve’s team mates have now found a case against other member(s) of the family which may make for some internal descention. Some time back, I was able to produce fresh evidence showing that on 26th January ’66 the Percy’s must have been very busy at the bowsers of their family run outer Newcastle gas station tending to a flood of returning holiday makers heading south along the New England Hwy. When inlisting in the RAN the soon to be serving naval rating gave Garage attendant as his occpation as opposed to oppotunistic multiple abducter and child slayer which he aspired to become. However Ms. Kurve and her present bactracking cream team, time to move on to greener pastures pet for whilst Percy’s parents may have bred a monster in the making, they were most definately not involved in the BC kid’s uplifting and disappearance.
Hi John, did you miss me?
Sure did Jacquie, particularly your lack of charm, which brings to mind our unloved Deny the cat woman whos name be synonymous with spiteful slurs, lies and gross effluence. I know I can speak for like minded Satin Man followers and an onboard moderator who must still recall fondly your combined efforts to vilify and belittle yours truly.
Oh John, you never cease to amaze me with your delightful insults and charming
personality. Clearly, your wit is unmatched by the rest of humanity, and your ability to spew venomous words is truly impressive. I’m sure your “like minded Satin Man followers” are just as enamoured with your delightful demeanor as | am. And let’s not forget about the “onboard moderator” who must be thrilled to have such a charming and respectful member like yourself in their community 👀 😒😒
Did you find the information about Joyce you were looking for John?
Jacquie
Yep sure did, thanks to Stirling efforts by our intrepid geni researcher Peter Davidson. Thanks for the concern and if further information comes to hand I’ll certainly post it.
EyeMedia
I see you’re still a debutante which is where you’ll remain with non conformist views such as some of those you’re pushing of late. I’m an old meddler from times past and know how it is to be scorned and constantly ridiculed or even ignored by the status quo creatures of habit with no worthwhile opinions or ideas of their own. Your recent post apropos the importance of identifying all early witnesses eg., the two elderly ladies in the park and a young girl accompanying; plus Nancy’s friend who left town days after the abductions and others who came forward later. I have tentitively identified and named most of these folk and if you care to read through this thread in its entirety, who knows what can be gleaned if you keep an open mind.
……it mght be worth noting that as a result of my enquiries, I was able to get the ear of both the former S.A. Atorney General and Minister of Police, but not the senior Sapol Police Investigator or the cold case Superintendent, neither of whom thought fit to answer my letters, as might be expected in accordance with police procedural practice.
…… you were able to get the ears of both the former S.A. Atorney General and Minister of Police.
And what…….. ?
……both lost their jobs, though before leaving office, I was able to determine that one had may have had attached ear lobes. Not sure which one though, it was a while back
No John, stay on topic. I’m not understanding why/ what the relevance is?
…you must know that details of personal private discussions at such levels are not for public discosure; unless obtained through freedom from information channels at the government ministerial level, or alternatively to subpoena my records. Take your pick Jacquie, I just follow legal process.
WOW! 😂😂😂😂😂
“Talks at such levels” “not for public disclosure”
No John, just no! 😂
To start with, YOU – not me, YOU- are the one who made the comment and thus brought it up for discussion on a PUBLIC THREAD.
But, of course, the only reason you mentioned it at all is because perhaps you think it makes you sound more important than you are?
Or maybe you were thinking that it somehow magically adds some sort of credibility to your outlandish conspiracy theories persecuting the Snoswell family.
Unfortunately for you John, having family members who are and have been previously on both the Senate and the House of Representatives, I’m in a reasonable position to counter your attention seeking efforts with a few hard home truths. I can assure you – their career position may be equip them with certain power and privileges, but they are just normal people? Having the ear of a person ‘at that level’ hardly seems to be of any achievement? 😂😅 I can flip thru my contacts right now, hit call and immediately have the ears of several people ‘at that level’ 🤣 and what?
What does that mean? Nothing?
It doesn’t magically increase your credibility or importance to dribble out random comments about having had (NON-privileged) privet discussions with a person or person(s) in such a position? They meet with people who are complete whack-jobs such as yourself on at least a weekly basis- without fail; it’s all just apart of the job of being a public servant.
Welcome back Jacquie, it’s good to see you again..
John, you once said something along the lines of the police on the case had your submissions and they told you they were in the correct place?
Don’t quote me on that, but it was similar..
When the police say that, and this is coming from a credible source, but like you I can’t name names.
They told me when someone provides them with content like yours they have to follow it up, which they did, as David said above somewhere he was in touch with the police.
Once they have gone over your evidence it goes the way of the McIntryers evidence, straight into the trash!!
And one more thing, when you “speak” to someone in here that are members of the BF, they don’t read your posts, they don’t come here full stop, so Eye Media will only see what you said to them if I tell them, which i’m not going to.
I made the mistake of telling Kurve that you replied to her and she asked me to screen shot it as she’s never come in here before or since.
So I would suggest that if you want to “speak” to them you join the forum, I can’t say that you would last a day but at least you would get your messages across!!
Deni: if ever I related to you or any other person that the Sapol had responded to me in the manner you describe, then that would have been a total falsehood, truth being, that apart from my contacts with them back in late 1974 or early 1975 I’ve not had any response to my communications at all. As for the rest of your idle pontifications, I’m neither critical or otherwise, just so long as the spirit of fairness prevails. PS. Just today I read on ABC that a notorious non compliant un named paedophile has been released from his detention on the orders of a S.A. Justice McIntyre (female). How interesting what?
Eye Media,
Now I have your attention I’m stoked to see that some thinking person has taken the initiative to move on from the status quo, single entity long shot perps that have been at the forefront of BF BC theory since day one. Your latest thoughts on multiple offenders and a set plan of implementation along with it’s own witness accounts to thwart local police inquiries are not new. Your having raised them to the shock horror of BF Satin Man, Munro, BSVE, Brown & Percy fans in ARB, Drop Bearess, Kurve and team captain Deni, is however a breath of fresh air and well worth the long wait. Don’t expect elevation to any Big Footy ranking though, you’re stuck with debutant, so long as you maintain your present unanimously unpopular stance and your bottom points to earth. Good luck
Thoughts Deny, Jacqueline?
My thoughts are that Eyemedia isn’t ‘stuck’ with being a debutant at all John, having alternative theories contrast to those of popular belief is somewhat irrelevant. To achieve an elevation in one’s ‘ranking’ (dissimilar to the conspiracy theory that you have just alleged), simply requires a more active participation.
Nice try though 😉
Jacquie,
That means you’d be ranked a minow or mini-mite seeing as you have never posted on BF/BC that I’m aware of unless you go under another name Heaven forbid ….As for Eye Media’s perpetual bottom of the ladder ranking, I’d suggest that if he/she want’s to move up a rung or two they might try not being so smart.
John, you’re probably better off just sticking to your ‘acquarobics’. Detective work clearly isn’t your thing…
My name is Jacquie? And I am a member on the BF site?
Jacquie. bully for you. BF/BC will most likely just give you a good kick up the ring for further damaging their renowned poor track record.
If only we could post photos in here Jacquie LOL
“Thoughts Deny, Jacqueline?”
My thoughts Johnny are that you don’t have Eye Medias attention and hopefully you never will.
So why not bite the bullet, so to speak, and answer them in the BF, it’s obvious that you Troll the place!!
Clive: I have it on good authority that THIS is where the big secret lies. If true than we can expect to see VC back in the good books when the time is ripe. A fine & honourable servant of the people be Vickie Chapman of Kingston town.
For the record, I may have traced Jim’s older sister Joyce Muriel Beaumont to her brother Max’s address in Deakin ACT mid 1966. She and mother Florence Muriel had vacated the old family home at Joslin Adelaide in 1959 when Nancy took over tenancy. There remains no trace of their respective deaths that I’ve ever been able to find which is most concerning from a case perspective.
I have tried to post a previous comment (a response to JS) twice but I think it went to spam.
I have no intention of commenting any further on the Beaumont children case because a) it’s obvious that someone groomed Jane before abducting the three kids and b) the case attracts a lot of loonies who spray unfounded accusations around as if there was no tomorrow (Stuart Mullins, the McIntyres, John Sanders etc).
I would however state that the abductor and presumed killer may be someone completely unknown to us and not one of the notorious serial killers usually mentioned or some guy who liked a bit of cross dressing.
One case that is sometimes linked to the Beaumont children is the Wanda Beach Murders of January 1965. Again there are plenty of suspects and some believe there is a link between the two cases via Derek Percy (unlikely). I visited Cronulla in 1983 as well as Glenelg in 1985 so both events have interested me for a long time.
The Wanda Beach case always reminds me of a terrible murder of two females when I was living in Darwin in 1983. This came a couple of months before I luckily (unluckily for JS and NP) missed a mass killing at Ayers Rock, or Uluru, when I left the Inland Motel a few hours before Douglas Crabbe drove his Mack truck into the bar there in the early hours of 19 August 1983, killing five and injuring many more. Crabbe was moved to a jail in Perth and recently entered a minimum security prison to take part in a pre-release re-socialisation program.
See: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2023-02-21/douglas-crabbe-mass-murderer-uluru-nt-resocialisation-program/102005346
To quote from Wikipedia on the Darwin Murders:
“Martin Leach (born 11 January 1959 in New Zealand), is a convicted rapist and double murderer in Australia, and has been described as one of, if not the Northern Territory’s worst, killer.
Leach is the longest serving prisoner in the Northern Territory, and is currently imprisoned at the Darwin Correctional Centre, serving three consecutive life sentences without parole for his crimes.
…On 20 June 1983, an eighteen-year-old local woman, Janice Carnegie, and her fifteen-year-old cousin, Charmaine Aviet, were swimming at a popular recreational waterhole at Berry Springs. Leach watched the pair for some time, before forcing them at knifepoint to accompany him to a nearby gully.
He stabbed Janice in the stomach when she attempted to reach for Leach’s knife. Following the stabbing, he then raped her. He stabbed and killed Charmaine, then stabbed Janice in the neck; a pathologist testified it probably took her 5 to 10 minutes to die. Their naked bodies were later found bound and gagged in a shallow grave.”
This case seems to have been long forgotten in Australia, possibly because the victims were of Singaporean descent. But it proves that someone who had previously been convicted of rape but was not known to have killed anyone before could savagely murder two people in cold blood and in broad daylight.
For details of the case see The Queen v Leach. from the Supreme Court of The Northern Territory hearing of 2004, but it is NOT a pleasant read.:
https://supremecourt.nt.gov.au/__data/assets/pdf_file/0006/769488/2004NTSC60-R-v-Leach-12-Nov-2004.pdf
Scroll down to Index and click on Facts to skip all the legal jargon.
It is an interesting document because it gives psychiatric and neuropsychological assessments of this appalling individual, and as well as providing a disturbing account of the murders it also relates how one person could kill two females in a place where there were other people around at the time and how he was caught fairly quickly after some tip offs from his wife and neighbours. Of course it is much more of a parallel with the Wanda Beach Murders than the disappearance of the Beaumont children.
Also see: https://www.smh.com.au/national/nt-murderer-and-rapist-to-die-in-jail-20070207-gdpey7.html
Think I can go one or three better than Steve H. (Haluciator) with his fantasy visits to multiple murder scenes whilst on his swing by visit to Oz in 1982/83. For starters I had been to those same places long before he knew of their existance. Starting with Wanda beach, I lived in the shire from 1964 and my mates and I were familiar with those sand dunes up from Nth. Cronulla. As for the Glenelg area, can recall it very well from when I was stationed there during ’67 and again in 68/69 and whilst I was familiar with basics of the Beaumont/SM basics, can’t say if I visited the SM death site, though I knew the Moseley St. & Jetty Rd. As for central Australia eg., Alice Springs, Ayers Rock and Pine Gap, I happened to be part of a Compol police presence in ’76 conducting site perimeter patrols to check subversives protesting uranium exports and US base presence. That should suffice; wouldn’t want to be judged in the same dead shit boring category as the one and lonely ‘I’ve been everywhere man’
Australia Day celebrations and remembering 58th anniversary of Beaumont Children Jane 9, Arnna 7 and Grant 4 disappearance Glenelg S.A. January 26th 1966.
LMAO that Sanders now talks about the Beaumont children’s “disappearance”. For years he has been maligning Nancy for hoodwinking the Australian public by pretending that the kids had vanished when all along she had secreted them to her former main squeeze’s family to save them from the “nefarious” Max Beaumont who he accused of sex crimes even though the Max in question was an entirely different person.
Of course Nancy just chuckled with glee to see how much time, effort and money went into the search for the missing three whilst poor old Jim was going out of his mind with worry. Not to mention all the others who were in on the conspiracy including the kids themselves who just accepted their separation from their doting parents with complete equanimity and to this very day still go along with the pretence that they aren’t the absent siblings.
Now we have a dreary RHONJ fanatic who apologises to Slanders (I used to call him that many moons ago) for some obscure reason on the ‘On the trail of Dorothy Robertson’ thread and who was shocked to learn that Stuart Mullins (an even bigger egotist than GC) and Mostyn Matters are related. Indeed Mullins’ cousin “is Mostyn Matters who was the first detective to speak to a distraught Mr and Mrs Beaumont at the Glenelg police station on January 26th 1966.” As Stu said of Mostyn on FB, “He’s a legend, Grumpy at times but a legend”.
Our CM commenter whines:
“Nance was a drunk. Dad was a patsy and a crook.”
Next she/he’ll be saying that a drunk Carl Webb was a nonce and that he died after scoffing a crook pasty. That’s trolls for ya!
Veteran CM readers may remember that I was able some time back to link former SA premier Don Dunstan via childhood friend Nan Sparrow (who lived opposite Jo Thomson) via future husband Dr John Barkly Bennett to cousin Doff J Webb/Robertson. Seems like Mullins’ ‘Unmasking The Killer Of The Missing Beaumont Children’ FB acolytes really have it in for Don, presumably cos he was a (small l) liberal and not a neo-fascist – eg:
“Top fan
Michael Rehn
[Harry] Phipps was a mate of Don Dunstan wasn’t he, and I guess a close associate of that merry bunch of peadophiles [sic], perverts and deviants who loved and were looked after by the SA Premier !!!”
“Steve Kenefick
…Dunstan more into young boys as he was guy [sic]. Bevan von Eimens [sic] group of friends in hi places.”
Makes you think that the contributors to CM are a relatively sane bunch.
Denny:
Looks like you’ve got the go ahead to resume your always engaging spite filled accusory comments here once more. This as opposed to testing the patience and resolve of Big Footy ‘A’ team dullards hoping for divine guidance, with the endless loop of trash you’ve trotted out since your rant with Grant. Being a woman you can tell all to our new ‘Llewsons’ team leader and fellow traveller Robert Nowak who will believe every lie in your repetoir…a word of warning, our Bob ain’t a cat lover so best to keep yours, in whatever form it be, well clear of the live screen AP.
As to where Steve H @ Bob Nowak sourced his LMAO? tagged fabrication be a testimony to his Slanders fixated and distracted state of mind of a madman. T’was me that twigged to the blunder by a well meaning informant regarding the kid’s uncle Max, who as a consequence was tauted prime candidate for the crime. As for my years of maligning Nancy Beaumont and placing her at the forefront of being a villain, I would advise those interested to study carefully the full context
of my related research and offerings before make any rash conclusions. Take for instance my long suspect list of those who played key roles or had been party to the abductions. These people number in the region of six, all but one of whom be deceased and they have all been referred to in my earlier posts along with specific roles played. Need any answers, I’m not going anywhere, but please don’t try to distort their meaning or I’m easily upset. get upset.
Wing Commander E. A. Beaumont, former decorated RAF pilot and later a RAAF base commander in WW2 was well known to Nancy’s future betrothed, Bronte ‘Llewsons’. Prior to being railroaded to New Guinea from his safe desk job at RAAF Malala near his own home town in September 1943, the noncom had been hauled before his WC charged with the theft of government property including essential aviation petrol. To avoid mandatory Court Marshalling and imprisonment Bronte opted for summary sentencing in the form of 28 days field punishment followed by immediate tranfer to the war ravaged Pacific theatre of ops. where he spent the next fifteen months or so. I somehow get the feeling that Bronte may have had reason to be fixated with name Beaumont in after years.
“get upset.” gotta be joshing not this black duck nosiree! All jokes aside might I caution, that there be deviants attracted to this thread through bloodlust and a morbid facination with death especially the slaughter of innocent kids. Case in point being the Beaumont children, Jane, Arnna and Grant who are believed by police and some amateur sleuths to have been abducted, molested then cruely murdered. This of course be no laughing matter although there are a few deeply disturbed macabre fanatics the likes of Denny T., Steve H and others who suggest otherwise; as evidenced by their childish online abreviated unfunny captions eg., LOL & LMAO.
@S-s-s-slithery Sanders
Just like you to ignore my constructive and well-sourced comments as you slink and wriggle through the ooze of dank, tenebrous undergrowth on your way to sink your toxic fangs into the flesh of some poor innocent babe like me or Deni. If not that you try to ingratiate yourself with others by curling and gliding your way round their persons in a fake, very ‘umble, obsequious, bum-sucking manner- your current victim being Calypso, someone you previously referred to on this site in the most unflattering terms imaginable. Still, if some people have no self-respect and continue to parlez cosily with a lower life form like you that’s their lookout. LMAO!
Of course you submerge your scaly, leprous, noxious self further down into the mire with your baseless, laughable, libellous claim that some of us are “deviants attracted to this thread through bloodlust and a morbid facination [sic] with death especially the slaughter of innocent kids”. Since you have contributed more to it than everyone else put together I can only leave it to others to determine what that says about your sick, festering, perverted mind.
As you made your first comment on this thread on May 13, 2016 at 2:04 am but didn’t arrive at your malevolent, depraved and preposterous claims about Nancy’s pernicious plot until the end of 2020 that gave you more than four years of “revelling” in the sort of debauched, vile and warped fantasies that you accuse others of indulging in.
I, on the other hand, have made precisely two contributions here before this one – you’ve made six just this month! As I said in my comment over on the ‘On the trail of Dorothy Robertson thread’ yesterday you and your mate Morgan are living in a post-truth world where little things like historical evidence, documentation, first hand accounts, solid research, scientific investigation, expertise and forensic analysis count for absolutely nothing. Instead you wallow in the confines of your solipsistic, megalomaniac, chest-beating, tub-thumping, narrow minded and bigoted little bubbles. And unlike Trump or Putin you’re just a sad little nobody who has to stalk others on social media for your cheap, nasty and serpentiform kicks.
Got the message John?
You call someone a deviant at your peril, mate!
Another initialism for you.
KMFA
KMFA @ Steve H @Bob Nowak: “You call someone a deviant at your peril mate”. News for you troll baiter.You’re a Deviant and a no one, big ‘D’ and small ‘n’. What ever peril you may have in store, just ‘bring it on home to me’ and you can KMFA while your at it. Idle threats from a idle nobody don’t faze me none.
@Be my baby Bob,
Short list gang of six LMAO gag line: Bronte Mourilyan 1921, John Cleveland 1928, Dorothy May 1930, Gladys Emily 1893, Jean Gladys 1926, Maxwell Thomas 1923.
Just to get things in some perspective regarding my family of main interest ie., those in the preceding list, John Cleveland ‘Llewsons” of Keith, who died in 2014, was listed in death notice per Centralia Advocate. The paper’s circulation be mostly confined to Alice Springs and localities north to Tennant Ck. and Katherine NT as opposed to tiny Keith 1800 kilometres south towards the Victorian S.A. border. In the case of John’s eulogy, there be mention of his older sister Jean (Gladys Langley assumed still living then (now 97) plus some nephews and such, but nothing of any progeny which should have included Jane, Richard, Nancy Helen and David Grant. With regard to these four, only Richard bn. 1958 is mentioned in S.A. newspaper births., however the other three have their respective marriages recorded. NB: Nancy Helen & David Grant might sound familiar to researchers with half a brain.
It was mentioned by Deveson early in the JBC thread that, the Beaumonts followed Rechabite beliefs and rituals. That didn’t materialise in my research of of the listed families faiths which be as follows. Apart from Grant who gave preference to C of E upon inlistment, others, namely his dad Grant Williiam and brother Maxwell were of mainstream Methodist faith. Of those in my suspect list, there was a smattering of Protestant faiths including, Church of Christ, Baptist, Congregational, Lutheran and The Family Church in the case of the nominated adoptive ‘Llewsons’. It does appear that apart perhaps from the Beaumonts all stood close by their Kirk.
Denny at Big Footie in her most recent outing asks her team to give thought to where I would have secreted the children after last confirmed sighting at Wenzels bakery Glenelg. In answer and with now good nowledge of street layouts aided by some rather extensive research, I am able to opin the following. It be presumed the kids, set off with their lunch purchase intending to take the bus home as per Mum’s directions, nearest being fifty yards south along Moseley st. It was at this point they must have met with a people they knew well and so were happy to be led down a laneway off Moseley to a vacant house near Milton St. which became the staging point. Some time probably late that evening after re appraising the locality for change, transfer to yet another vacant house in nearby Chapel St. may have followed as a caution. In keeping with the original plan the penultimate move occurred on Friday or Saturday to an address in Diagonal Rd. near the Beaumont home, well known to the children and occupied by the plotters. Last phase of the removal and resettlement at ‘Ng’ must have occurred no later than Monday 31st January 1966, a day prior to start of the new school year. About as good as it gets or needs to be from me, and now to await reaction and commentary which is sure to prove most entertaining.
From ‘On the trail of Dorothy Robertson’ thread:
John Sanders
on January 29, 2024 at 11:44 am said:
Bob Nowak: I strongly object to your reference to my being a “rabble rouser” and humbly beseach [sic] thee to withdraw the comment forthwith with apologies or face the consequences.”
From this thread:
“John S-s-s slithery sanders
on January 30, 2024 at 10:29 pm said:
KMFA @ Steve H @Bob Nowak: “..Idle threats from a idle nobody don’t faze me none.”
“Face the consequences”! Idle threat indeed you wanker.
Unlike you my travels/travails in the Australian outback were all enjoyed/endured when I was on my own. You had your COMPOL mates to keep you warm at night and were living in the lap of luxury and travelling everywhere in comfort with a guard and escort. Perhaps that explains why you are so soft, flabby and dissipated in both body and mind. I on the other hand am a fighting fit he-man who knows how to take care of bidness. (Irony intended here folks!)
I have never – repeat never – lied about being anywhere, meeting anyone or being acquainted with something (eg Ray Charles’ early records!) here or indeed anywhere else. It simply ain’t my style. I don’t care whether I impress anyone or not, or indeed whether they think I’m a complete tosser as most probably do. You on the other hand are a crawling, creeping cesspool dwelling Joe Blake who so desperately craves attention that you will shitpost incessantly on social media just to get your daily five seconds in the sordid spotlight which you think validates your miserable, squalid and pathetic existence.
From Tbt:
John Sanders #
I’ve also noted that, even when caught out, GC has never been known to retract, not to my knowledge…”
January 31, 2024″
ROFLMFAO
I’ve always done my level best to keep this thread on track and respectful in view of it’s content, namely in that it involves missing children whose fate is after many years of hope is yet to be determined according to police. Might I remind, as if such be necessary that their uncertain fate be no laughing matter, though sadly there will always be those who some who seem to derive an inner sensual delight over the gruesome possibilities. This being evidenced by humourless sign offs of late that must only serve to exemplify a manic prevailing state of irrepressable morbid depravity within an evil persona.
How low can you go Sanders?
“I’ve always done my level best to keep this thread on track and respectful in view of it’s content…”
When you’ve written reams of defamatory comments about Max Beaumont being a sexual deviant and predator? An accusation you also make against Deni (who you refer to as Dunny) and myself by the way.
When you’ve constantly demeaned female commenters by calling them luv, sweetheart, sweetness, my old doxy, old thing etc?
When you’ve stalked another commenter on various forums, told them you know better than them where and how they lived and doxxed information about them?
When you’ve regularly posted troll comments here under the names “Minstrel Janet”, “Kara” and various characters from the Home and Away soap opera?
When you’ve persistently trashed the names of Nancy and Jim Beaumont who went through decades of unbearable pain and suffering?
When you’ve insulted, defamed and deliberately upset people you accuse of being part of the conspiracy by denying their true identity as the Beaumont children, with the full support and collusion of the moderator, who called THEM trolls and told them to “get stuffed”?
When you’ve accused another commenter of masquerading as those people you have bullied, just as you accuse anyone you can’t manage to debate rationally and constructively with of posting here under other identities such as “Robert Nowak” in order to set up an ad hominem smokescreen?
When you’ve referred to the SA police as “perfumed fairies” and “sniggling buffoons”?
When you’ve lied about your contacts with senior SA police officers?
When you’ve hijacked this thread to brag, boast and gloat about “solving” this mystery: “…my Beaumont Investigation is all but done & dusted, apart from a few things concerning level of involvement attribution that still need tidying up. I”m also awaiting word from Des Bray at ‘Safcol’…” Jesus Christ! It’s all about you and your ego soldier, not about any concern for the kids!
I could go off on another rant but I’m beginning to feel pity for you cobber. You quite clearly don’t know your arse from a hole in the ground.
This discussion is now closed. I feel sullied and besmirched by entering the debate here.
Even the one time looney-tune contributor Glen (remember him?) said: “This thread is absolutely horrible and the majority of the people that contribute to it are sick in the head.”
Have to agree with an old friend who also seems to be lost in action:
” misca
on June 15, 2021 at 4:29 am said:
Geez Nick. I can’t believe you let these kind of shit comments through. Doxing as well as shaming one’s beliefs. Disgusting. Are you actually JS (passive aggressive to boot) or are the clicks that important to you?”
Or perhaps even more pertinently the family member whose daughter and brother Mr Sanders so cruelly and unforgivably mocked and derided who was forced in despair to comment : “Anyway that’s all I will be saying to you John and Nick I think you are both pathetic weak individuals, hiding in your dark rooms printing bullshit, I think you are both trolls and in finishing of you can both get stuffed.”
Couldn’t agree more!
Still no word on Jim’s missing mum and sister although there be some suggestion that Joyce Muriel may have joined brother Max in ACT. Does anyone recall my post back in late ’21 regarding a Myheritage member G. Beaumont 50/60 (Aust) looking her up. Only one G. Beaumont of that vintage comes to mind and he be very much alive.
ROFLMFAO @ Robert Nowak,
As they say, repeat it often enough, folks will start believing; sadly the truth be othererwise in your case and same applies to Deni. Nobody with half a brain would believe any of your endless ‘here we go loopty loo’ rantomimes. You pair should team up and do your rave rage on ‘Bristol ‘as Talent’.
Deny’s fiend Lyn posted on Big Footy yesterday enquiring after Seaton Park schoolboy Peter Niemirowsky who went missing in 1967: My ever reliable but difficult to access trace source confirms Peter was recovered and unharmed. Another even more reliable paywall source reveals a Peter Paul Niemirowsky died in 2003 and that he be interred at Clearview cemetery. Best, retards!
In an interesting side line that I came by long before Steve H’s scurrulous self serving and henous put down of my reference to Byron Deveson’s equally flawed identification of Max Beaumont as a likely suspect. I identified the real villain as being a Glenelg plumber of the same age Maxwell JOHN Beaumont, not related to Jim’s family. It might have ended then and there but for a recent discovrry that MJB be related (in a most peculiar way) to convicted criminal Emil Tusim who by 1966 was then a painter (not artist) by profession. Early in 1972 Emil travelled to Port Moresby; so what doubters would say; so what being that his trip overlapped with one taken by my Maxwell Langley to the very same destination in PNG. Max be the deceased husband of Nancy’s friend Jean (now 97) the sister of her former fiance Bronte ‘Llewsons’. Some might recall that I had previously pointed out Max as being the fellow, who appears in a group photo with Jean, Nancy and the children before they were taken six months later. In his WW2 Navy inlistment file there’s mention of an injury to a finger on Max’s left hand which is clearly evidenced in the caravan pic taken by Jim ..That isn’t all, but enough to feed those with an inquiring mind if there be any out there.
Won’t hurt to raise the subject of two other missing members of the Beaumont family once more, in hope that someone may know something. In essence it be related to the kid’s granny Florence Muriel (1895) and maiden aunt Joyce Muriel (1921), their address in 1959 being 22 Lambert Street Joslin a suburb of Adelaide.
When they left, the family home it was then taken over by Mrs. G. A. Beaumont (Nancy) and sold in 1960. In researching the disappearance I have tried every avenue available but, apart from one hint that they were with Max in Canberra nothing more was forthcoming. The Geni Beaumont family site has created a deal of confusion for research by inputing of non relatives plus giving death dates for Max and Joyce of circa. 26 January 1966, that of course being the same date of the Beaumont Children’s uplifting from Glenelg. I get the feeling that cold case police would not have seen reason to extend investigations much beyond those of their predecessors and mores the pity. My advice to them be to shape up or ship out.
milongal: might be interested in some news from Glenelg. Today a large fire destroyed Murphy House on the grounds of Our Lady of Victories Church Cnr.
High and Chapel Streets. It being near to where the Beaumont kids were last seen and your own suggested possible pick up point.
….As you’ll recall the grounds were opposite the rabbit warren properties 2 to 8 that were occupied by the ‘Llewson’ clan, with their old Congregational church across from No. 2 on cnr. Jetty Road with Milton St. ‘T’ section separating. Police say the fire was an arson job.
Don’t bother with Cynthea Jenke’s Wikitree and Peter Davo’s Geni respective inputs on Florence Muriel and Joyce Beaumont as they seem to be in the same camp, ie, dead wrong on all that we need to know. As for the 22 Lambert Rd. Josln address that they vacated in ’59m then after Nancy’s short one year tenure, seems that it was rented rather than sold and this appears to have been the case when Sands & McDougall finished in 1973; The address being now merely an empty block of land.
Happens that a regular contributer to the Big Footy forum came up with the contention ‘that it be unlikely an intending abductor would accompany his victims into Wenzel’s cake shop for their lunch purchase, in certain knowledge that he could be recognised and his presence recalled by the staff later when the kids were reported missing’. As it so happens, I had theorised this same scenario based on reality; fact being that Fred Wenzels and my main suspect’s parents, lived in the same street just three houses apart in 1966. It would be most unusual for two old farming families from the same district not to have been known to each other for these and other reasons referred to earlier..
Peter Davidson: in re your redacted BF update for Jim Beaumont today. Wondering if you have any news on the death dates of his mother Florence Muriel Beaumont (Winter) bn. 1895 and sister Joyce Muriel Beaumont bn. 1921. Neither have been heard from in the intervening period since abduction and disappearance of the children.
John,
Believe it or not, actually trying to be helpful and constructive on this one…One possible reason Joyce Muriel Beaumont disappears from the records after 1947 (http://ciphermysteries.com/2013/12/05/somerton-man-jim-beaumont-connection#comment-471727, although you appear to have picked her up again living under her birth name in 1959 per http://ciphermysteries.com/2013/12/05/somerton-man-jim-beaumont-connection#comment-502783) is that *a* Joyce Muriel Beaumont (maybe not the one in question) married a Harold Jack in ’47 — the book/page of the South Australia marriage registration is 514/6359 per what shows up in a free search at https://www.genealogysa.org.au/.
It sucks big time that governments monetize historical vital records at the level they do, but the cheaper alternative to joining the Genealogy SA folks to see their transcribed version of the info would still be shelling out the $31.25 to the SA gov’t for a scan of the marriage record (https://bdm.cbs.sa.gov.au/bdmsaonline/dbnet.aspx?prprc=OAH), which would list her age, place of birth, and father’s name (but oddly, not the mother’s name until 1964 — https://www.sa.gov.au/topics/family-and-community/births-deaths-and-marriages/family-research).
Maybe you (or Peter Davidson, or someone else) already know that’s a dead end false match. If so, my bad — this is a party I’m coming very late to. If not, to the extent you’re interested in filling in the ’47-’59 gap that’s probably your best lead. If the marriage registration info matches “the right” Joyce Muriel Beaumont, then what happened to hubby and why she reverted to her maiden name become interesting questions.
…and by the way, just to be clear, I am not now nor have I ever been on the payroll or otherwise in the pocket of Big Vital Records. Sometimes you just have to suck it up and pay for the data you need to answer specific genealogical (or any other type of) research questions.
Gordon: pretty fair general assessment in your latest BS/TS “Bluey Somerton” offering which may provide a new breed of suitably biased anonymous punters with an alternate path away from the false trail taken by seconded FB Carl Webb status quo punters of yore. One important correction if I may, be with regard to the imposter’s brother Roy having had brown hair by your reckoning, whereas his hair was FAIR according to his 1940 inlistment papers.
Karl: Guess I’ll need to remain upbeat in hope that Peter has a new lead on the as yet still unaccounted for Beaumont family members, Florence & Joyce, hopefully not in vane. If you wish to be helpful, then maybe you’d like to help trace Nancy Beaumont’s ex fiance’s sister Jean Gladys Langley nee Snoswell, bn. 1926, who, by my reckoning can be seen posing with husband Maxwell (wrongly identified as Jim), Nancy and the three children in a 1965 caravan holiday snap. She was residing at Somerton Park at the time of Max’s passing in 1978, and whatsmore was known to be with us as late as 2017. Jenny Langley, imho nee be the key to final closure, no doubt in my mind at all.
Karl: In Nov. 1951 Jean had a son, Stephen John, but he’s long gone and ”we don’t know where he are” or what became of him, simply no mention at all on basic trap searches following his Glenelg birth notice in the Advertiser. His dad Max died in ’87 not ’78 as stated above and cremation marker makes no mention of any kith & kin for the old WW2 matelot with gammy left hand (as per WW2 RAN file & 1965 caravan holiday pic).
Karl: don’t be fooled by SA genealogy, they’re rogues like the rest and since being taken over lock stock and barrel by the ‘Kiss my Ass’ thieves, you’ll get nothing for nothing. Back in the day you could feed the name criteria format with any sort of name variation and it would spit out all it had on file for nix, eg. every Harold Jack came with a surname plus possible links to a marriage partner according to BDM state records. Needless to say, in the case of Joyce Muriel Beaumont nothing of any substance was forthcoming ie., only two viable Harold Jack candidates were noted, a Bollmeyer and a Morton both of whom were already spoken for. Cross checking with Ryerson and FAG providing confirmation thereof and besides I recall being able to find out from Trove that our Joyce Muriel Beaumont was still single when her brother Grant returned home from Japan that same year. I could go on with more relevant familial detail, that is if you are not completely bored to tears.
John,
Can’t help you (and certainly don’t have access to any databases you don’t) WRT Jean Langley. Living (or at least, recently living) individuals are (by design) hard to track down using the usual genealogical resources.
Not sure why I didn’t think of Find A Grave (and not sure why he didn’t show up as a likely candidate when you looked), but the winner of the (well, *a*) JMB matrimonial sweepstakes appears to be…DING DING DING…Harold Jack *Walters* (https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/248476956/harold-jack-walters). Searching that name in Genealogy SA finds the same marriage record 514/6359.
HJW was born in 1919, so just 2 years older than the JMB of interest, and back from serving in the Air Force since mid-’46 (https://vwma.org.au/explore/people/578272). DOB 21 May 1919, born Kent Town SA, father’s full name Henry John Walters. Based on the Sands & McDougall’s Directory of SA, his father appears to have still been living at 65 Robert St. in Croyden Park in ’47. Some discipline problems early on in his service, but appears to have straightened out and done well after that. Not seeing an obit in the Ryerson Index, unfortunately :-<
According to https://vwma.org.au/explore/people/578272, JMB's brother Grant was discharged on 30 Apr '47, so a big chunk of the year left for her to potentially marry in after his return…
Out of curiosity, what was your source for JMB living with her widowed mother in the late 50's? Sands & McDougall's doesn't list all members of a household, so just shows Mrs F M Beaumont at 29 Lambert St. SA electoral rolls (or at least their indexes) seem spotty on Ancestry and weren't any help.
Karl: in re my “source for JMB for living with her widowed mother in the late 50’s?” Lots of water under the bow since my early contributions on the long gone ‘Digital Labyrinth’ Beaumont blog (Lyal Shepard). You’re right about there being a window of opportunity for Joyce to marry Harry; her dad William Grant’s passing in late March 1947, brother Grant’s return from BCOF Japan late April, and young brother Maxwell’s discharge the same month makes for perfect timing as you pointed out. Now that you’ve been able to solve an integral piece of the puzzle, namely what became of Joyce Beaumont, perhaps her mum’s eventual fate may also become clear. Only mystery then remaining, not withstanding my well known thoughts on what became of the missing Beaumont children, far as I’m concerned woul be to establish whether Jean Langley is still living and if so her current status in the hope that she can shed light on certain events that went down at Glenelg on Australia Dad 1966. You’ll be pleased to hear that thanks to your initiatives I’ve now been able to suss out the Walters family abode circa.1980, it being within cooey of the Beaumonts and a similar distance to the Langley fortress. Perhaps worth noting is that the three Beaumont children were long gone from the scene by then, so too Max & Jean Langley who left the area shortly thereafter only to re surface out of the blue in the early 70’s; That’s where the trail ends, for now anyhow. Thanks!
Karl: Based on your incentives, I’ve now identified Anthony John and Gary Grant Walters as being first cousins to the Beaumont children, aged 17 and 15 years respectively in 1966 with Tony passing in 2000. So for the time being at least, with Sands & McDawdle SA down, that’s about as far as we can go with Joyce imo.
Karl: Can’t figure how I could have missed the birth notice of Jean Langley’s son in ’51. Perhaps it was a recent Trove entry, strange though that S.A. Genealogy gives a birth listing but nothing more even on ‘pay to play’ and there be no mention of him on FAG. Moreover, based a press report of Nancy Beaumont’s statement to police re an unamed (Max & Jenny) childless couple shown in a 1965 family holiday snap, we might assume that young Stephen Langley had likely as not died in infancy.
@newbie 11 (Big Footy),
What’s with today’s post of the blurred Yahoo courtroom sketch. I’m recalling your separated photo image of Max Langley (my ID) in the holiday group shot with his wife Jean and the Beaumonts at the caravan, sans Jim (Grant) who’s likely behind the camera. Whilst I’m confident of my ID I really don’t have anything to compare with apart from a thirties football photo which may well be a different Max Langley also from Glenelg. To complicate matters, an RAAF NAA file photo of Nancy’s ex fiance Bronte S……. be of similar general appearance to the cove in the ’65 shot.
Perhaps a photo of Maxwell Thomas Langley WW2 Naval Reserve is lying around somewhere?
An interesting, addendum to an earlier post re Max Langley’s return from PNG in early 1972, same month as Czech refugee and criminal Emil Tusim, associate of convicted rapist Maxwell JOHN Beaumont. Well turns out that Glenelg paedaphile Anthony Allan Munro had also returned from PNG in 1972, allbeit a few months later. Folks not familiar with New Guinea in those days, pre independence from Australia, it had very little going for it as a holiday destination…question being what were they there for, Tusim being a house painter, Langley insurance agent and Munro some sort of big company junior rep.