I’ve been looking at IP addresses of people submitting comments to Cipher Mysteries, and it looks very much as if I have unwillingly ‘acquired’ at least six different “Tamam Trolls” – that is, people leaving comments about the Somerton Man case…
* muddying the historical waters rather than clearing them
* misrepresenting evidence that is genuinely available
* defaming and indeed insulting the memory of various dead people
* suggesting speculative leads based on a whim and a half-thread of evidence
* engaging in promoting some kind of fantasy agenda with no relation to what actually happened
* pretending to be related to Jestyn
* just plain lying for reasons unknown (possibly even to themselves)
I try to be even-handed and open in how I deal with commenters on Cipher Mysteries, but – people – this is getting really boring.
Some days I wake up wondering whether these trolls are playing out some kind of anti-evidential role-playing game, where you win by “proving” that your character (randomly allocated by the dungeon master at the start of the game) was in fact the Unknown Man: and you get awarded XP every time you convince me to spend my dwindlingly small amount of money on following some spurious research lead to dig up some real evidence to prove you wrong.
If that’s even remotely true, then rock my riotous rowlocks, today’s +10 bonus bonanza goes to anonymous Aussie troll “Ayuverdica”. If you recall, he/she suggested that Thomas Lawrence Keane was the Somerton Man, based on… well, let me check my extensive notes… Keane’s mother’s surname’s being “Beaumont”. And nothing else at all as far as I can see, aside from pure whim.
Well, here are Thomas Lawrence Keane’s WW2 service records that I recently paid the NAA to digitize. Was he engaged in spying, espionage or any curious derring do? No. Was he a labourer who became a foreman but was medically discharged in 1944 because of high blood pressure? Yes.
More specifically, did Keane have grey eyes, a prominent mole on his left cheekbone and a noticeable gunshot wound scar on one thigh that still remained from his action in the First World War? Yes. So was he the Somerton Man? No, not even close. 🙁
What did the American’s have to do with Somerton man ? Not much. Their was a super secret organization working at the time called the pond. The pond used clandestine collection of information from a verity of sources including a serial killer. The Pond was able to show the extent to which the British were spying on the US. Most of their effort we know about was directed at communist subversion in the US government. You may have heard about Senator Joseph McCarthy “I have here in my hand a list of 205, a list of names that were made known to the Secretary of State as being members of the Communist Party and who nevertheless are still working and shaping policy in the State Department.” So the Somerton man may have been collecting information for the pond.
Personally, as someone who’s interested in historical ciphers rather than real-life crime, I’ve found all this vitriolic speculation pretty depressing. But that’s just my opinion – others can do as they like, and it’s for Nick to decide what he’ll tolerate.
My only real gripe is that, because this has attracted so many comments, I keep missing posts on threads that actually do interest me. Whenever I look at the Recent Comments list, all the Somerton Man posts have driven anything else into the background.
Any chance of ten most recent posts, rather than five? Or, in my personal opinion, that comments on the Somerton Man case can be kept a bit more relevant to the cipher aspect?
Maybe trolls could go play “Voynich” instead?
Tricia: I think you’ll find that Voynich trolls already have their own list. 😉
Vorpal swords ahoy.
Nick if a bit of banter and speculation isn’t your thing maybe the internet is not for you mate.
You encourage the behaviour that you so hate by this whiney carry on about trolls. It appears to me that a troll is anyone who disagrees with you.
If you know so much mate how come you haven’t solved the case already?
Trevor T: hahahahaha. Next!
Nick, I’m so confused in re the ‘point’ of all this ‘Keane” discussion. So, I tend to flatten myself (figuratively) against the hall walls and let the strolling trolls roll merrily along their goal!
See, you aren’t the only lonely fun/punster! hee hee hee…!
More fondly than funly yours,
beady-eyed wonder
Nick, on a more serious note in re the McCarthy hearings and “investigations” : A terrible period in American history, with so much power given to a seriously psychotic individual who “just happened” to have a lot of wealthy connections who were prominent in American politics.
I’m hying myself back to my favorite collection of folios. Cya!
bd
Sir Hubert, you may find some more amicable and interesting conversations ongoing (in re our “vavorite manuscript) between Diane and myself, with our recollections of various voynich discussions with Edith SherVood and Ellie Velinska.
Nick, Ve ‘ave to occasionally vollow the path less vandered, yeah?
beady 😉
Colonel Mustard, on the beach, with poison?
Do we know how/why Keane died?
The old John From Trick.
Would you believe.That’s the second oldest Troll trick I’ve ever seen.
Thomas Lawrence Keane’s father married Isabella Beaumont as “Thomas Kean”…No “e” at the end. I have researched many family trees and would not be in the least surprised to find such a variation.
A close inspection of those service records, however, shows two particularly interesting things:
1. On the first page the signature of the applicant T. L. Keane has an interesting T where the left horizontal stroke curves into the vertical stroke, but there is no horizontal stroke on the right side.
2. On the second page the applicant has signed again, with a similar T, but this time he has given his surname as Kean.
Remind you of anything?
vintschevski: nicely spotted, thank you.
All we need to find out now is whether Thomas Lawrence Keane’s grave is empty. 🙂
Not at all. Naturally I am not suggesting that the Somerton Man is Thomas Lawrence Keane – and I don’t think sarcasm was required.
There is a chance, however, that the items marked Keane or Kean in the suitcase could have belonged to Thomas Lawrence Keane. That probably means nothing at all, the Somerton Man could have acquired them in all sorts of ways and locations. On the other hand, maybe it does mean something – if nothing else, perhaps a Brisbane connection? We may never know, or perhaps it will eventually turn out to be a little piece in the jigsaw.
vintschevski: I was only being slightly flippant, which is a Barrier Highway short of being sarcastic. Stranger things than empty graves have happened, for sure.
As to what it means, I don’t know either. It certainly strengthens the idea that the two spellings were by the same person, though.
I find that Keane interesting – I think I’d noticed the ‘T’ before (which I don’t think is that uncommon), but not the missing ‘e’….
I don’t know where ‘Beaumont’ comes from, I assumed his mum’s name was ‘Burton’ (WWI record (1327) – Next of Kin = Ada Keane c/o Mrs Burton)
Interestingly, when he later re-enlists (2033) his next of kin is Mrs F. C. Token (I think this mighty be misspelling) which is vaguely consistent with his sister’s married name being ‘Toten’ (WWII record).
There’s a few mildly interesting differences in both WWI records….”Horse Breaker” on one, “Labourer” on the other; “Presbyterian” on one, CoE on the other, “Kelvin Grove Road” vs “Victoria St” (as far as I can tell, these are around the corner from each other – but Bowen Bridge deosn’t seem to exist as a suburb anymore)….
But all probably explainable by the passage of time….
NP: Wasn’t all this covered pretty extensively ages ago. He only came to notice because of his family tie-in with Peg Beaumont and her’s subsequently with Jim from Somerton Park/Glenelg. It appears that he was just some old digger with a gunshot wound to his thigh and a permanent drip, which along with his age, his somewhat diminutive physical stature and his generally unsophisticated antecednets, would surely exclude him being connected with SM in any way. That certainly includes the clothing as well as his accutrements and as for the name, with or without the ‘e’, I doubt whether old Tom would have known the difference. I also feel, if you don’t mind my saying so, that the re-emergence of this particular thread (note the title), hints of something being, albeit misnomarically rotten in Renmark.
While we’re still in the Glenelg area, someone with the books might like to check out 30 Partridge St. for the adopted son of Solomon, Harrie Bridgland who was living there into the 30s at least and who died in ’47. He had an uncle who was known as Solomon-Senior and a much younger step brother Ben, who may for all we know, have called himself Solomon-son. Although both lads were born of the orthodox faith on the paternal side, they were both known to have been gentile converts from a very early age, dad having died in 1908 when Ben was 11 and mum not being Jewish to my knowledg. Strange thing about Ben, a strapping big boy like his dad, he was a very well known lyricist and poet in the mid 20’s, as well as being a qualified accountant, but had dropped off the radar completely shortly after his marriage in ’31. He was, I believe, born in Palmerston (Darwin) in 1897 where the family had once been active in pearling and so I’m thinking that he may have returned to take up with the old life of lugging and diving. Dr. Dwyer, in his examination of SM noted old signs of sun burning to the lower limbs extending to the groin but nothing on the torso or upper body. Can anyone think of an occupation other than perhaps a deckhand in the tropics, that a person might be likely to sport such a distinctive tan other than possibly a beachcomber or Thai/Burma Railroad worker.
After a little more digging, it seems that Ben, Vaiben Louis Solomon Jr. aka Vaib Louis, the son of Vaiben Louis Solomon, was born 31/5/1897 in Menindie SA and is listed as having died in Fitzroy Victoria, 1982. This information does not come with a date although I think there may have been a registration number. His spouse is said to have passed in the same year at Ballarat and may have been seen off under her maiden name Clarabelle Lilia Charlotte Mitchell. Most of the above information was obtained from the father’s detailed bio on wiki so it must be right! right?.
Nick, why do you allow this mentally unbalanced women to post on this forum? There is no evidence her ex-husbands father was the Somerton Man. There is no evidence her ex-husband was the Zodiac Killer. None. Yet, she continues to post and post and post and post and post.
Bumpkin: I’m now blocking all oncoming comments that (a) assert something I am certain is utterly false and/or (b) are aimed at provoking, goading or needling named commenters.
There will always be a 10% of comments that get through this filter, but please be reassured that I am trying to make a positive difference here.
Bumpkin: also, I thought I had specifically deleted the preceding comment, but must have finger-slipped when the bus went over a bump. 🙁
Nick; Please be assured that I only posted my above question/ comment to you because I have great respect for you, cipher mysteries and most of your posters. Thank you.
Bumpkin: So, it’s my way or the Barrier Highway for you with regard to who should and who should not be heard eh. Nutty as she is, she does have an interesting and thought provoking take on most subjects, albeit not always being prepared to respond directly to our interrogatories, which is her right. My advice is to be patient; just hang in there, let her make the play, wait with baited breath for her next earth shattering, outrageous and perhaps off subject offering and take it for what it’s worth. She’s not hurting anybody and I for one, am quite happy to put up with her nonsense until she decides to allow us a snippet of relevance, one that is likely to set us off on a new and most interesting trail. Also you might have a little more respect for the wisdom of your elders who have the advantage when it comes to history and please consider the oft quothed timeless adage ‘there but for the Grace &c.’….PS. Have a little chuckle next time you get together with your ‘treos amigos’ out west, it could be catching!.
John S; With all due respect, I believe it is wrong to [deleted]. You write, “She’s not hurting anybody”. I disagree. She has a family. Her son has repeatedly denied any connection between her and either Somerton Man or Zodiac Killer… PS. Have a little humility. It goes a long way.
Bumpkin: After nearly seventy years of nothingness,, in one instance and fifty in another, humility doesn’t seem to be helping us all that much. But if we were to combine it with a little cunning, tact and some gentle pursuasion, maybe, just maybe we will have some chance to draw out the truths we seek. I know nothing of our informant’s son, but I do know a lot about her and what I do know, I respect. Admittedly she can be a caution at times, as we all are, however, and I beseech, have a little patience and allow her room to manoeuvre. She certainly has certain important information at her whim, if she feels comfortable in divulging it. So what are we to do in the meantime?; by ridiculing and demonizing the lady, we are left with the nothingness we had before, so why give vent to our fruststrations; let’s just standby and see what transpires, shall we?. Perhaps there’s a surprise in store.
ex-husband = zodiac killer? sort of plausible for mine
ex-husband’s father = SM ? that’s a new one I must have missed, and I’d doubt it….
That said, how do we actually know she or her son are actually who they said they were either? (what if they are one and the same person looking for attention – perhaps obfuscating their IP address a little bit to appear to be elsewhere….or something).
In the past (even before I was milongal, when I was randomly using a different name each time, or something) I used to agree with NP’s general policy (which on the whole seemed to be “all posts are ok, even if they seem a touch crazy”) – and I think I still do.
From his perspective (as from any of ours, although I’d imagine he at least has some IP address info which allows him some better vetting than us) we are all just nutters arguing stupid ideas on his site…and everyone likes traffic if they have a blog. Granted, 3 rants in a row can be tedious to skip over, but I’ve probably been guilty of similar in the past. I find it hard sometimes to follow which post is replying to which and the like (which is exacerbated by such noise in the thread), but that’s sort of the nature of this sort of blogging.
I don’t really know what was blocked (I don’t normally come here on the weekend – it’s more of a timewaster (no offence intended) at work), but it’s NP’s blog and he can block if he wants to….
milongal: from the perspective of a blog owner (and comment moderator), I have to say it’s not quite that simple. Completely nutty comments raise the noise level up and drive people away: and conversely, whatever policy you try to put in place quickly runs into edge cases, where you want to delete half a post but leave the other half.
So the problem is actually what to do with all those half-nutty comments: editing them is extremely time-consuming and boring (and achieves little), while blanket-deleting them is a bit more draconian and a lot less liberal than most blog owners want to be. There is no right answer. 🙁
Macca & Nick: We’ve got a job to do so let’s do it!; what?.
A prayer for Filarete:
Sired by fact and out of fiction,
that’s your Voynich contradiction.
The plot does not translate to diction,
there lies the fault, the dereliction….
Are the merlons round or square,
we just don’t know and I won’t dare
to say you’re wrong, or I don’t care….
For who am I to probe and vet
the stated facts but yet,
if I was to have a bet,
an eachway chance, I’d say rosette….
The nubile nymphs, what do they mean,
by waving bits of womb and spleen.
Tasteless, sick and just obscene,
I’ll stick with Thomas Lawrence Keane….
The victuals shown are so absurd,
Some hint of tubers, some of turd.
No signs of game or fish or curd,
just one old dried-up gooney bird….
Now could this be our missing clue,
go back to 1422. Did Averlino go there too
when Zhen He tracked the oceans blue
and found a world he never knew….
They met some beauties of the Basque,
who bathed them in a wooden cask,
then rubbed them down, but please don’t ask,
what herbs were used, that’s not my task….
If you really need the knowledge,
then swing by Filarete’s old college.
Whilst there you’ll take the campus pledge,
not to question, nor to sledge
the Voynich script and tutelage.
Another interesting Solomonson was Reginald Alfred Harris and forgive me if I’ve mentioned him in the past. He was born in Tamworth to Selena Sarah Harris nee Solomon and Dr. Henry Louis Harris BM; we know they were married in 1881 but alas I can’t find any record of his birth date. It seems that he went through a messy divorce with Irene Clare nee Ware in 1916 so it might seem that he was likely to have been too old for our SM 1893/1908 range. Reg is described as beiing an engineer & chemist, though these qualifications were possibly fake and during bankruptcy proceedings in 1946 he claims not to have had a job in thirty years. He was also a self proclaimed inventor of hi tech devices but his man claim was for his motor spirit refining process termed ‘the secret formula’. He was an eembezzler, fraudster in reality and was never run to ground, so subsequent to his being declared bankrupt in Sydney, he would probably have been marked for retribution by the Jewish money lenders whom he had royally screwed. Old Reg subsequently disappeared and nothing was heard from him as a mortal entity; however, the Solomon families data bank have him listed as having died on 21/6/49 which raised my hackles. SM’s legal death declaration as a consequence of a Coronial Inquest was announced on that very day, which is most likely a coincidence but worth mentioning in much the same manner as poxy old Tom Keane who was such a favourite in his day. Somebody with more reliable search facilities than mine might care to follow-up, and it might be noted also that Harris Providors had a shop in the Jetty Road, Glenelg district around the time of the 1948 Air Pageant.
If any keen follower of this thread still has doubts about passing up on old drippy dick’s possible connection with Somerton man, let me put your mind at rest. Apart from six very good elementary reasons, that should have been enough to exclude Tom and SM being one and the same person from the onset, the one obviously overlooked piece of evidence is their likely variance in the plumbing department. Front line soldiers have always been subjected to all sorts of grunge caused by not being able to wash regularly and one particular part of the anatomy is subject to more concern than others. In randy Pte. Keane’s case, the decision to whip off his unhygenic foreskin would have been undertaken on his admission to Cairo STC as a matter of course, partly as punishment for his non authorised discharge (self inflicted wound) but also as a means of preventing further incapacity in the field. His condition was apparently severe enough for his repatriation home leading to subsequent discharge, afterwhich he reinlisted, this time as a former bushman and horsebreaker, which he never was. He probably hoped to get back to Egypt in the Light Horse or remount battalion and lots more of the old familiar crumpet pie. Alas he ended up in France and almost lost the rest of his plumbing with a GSW to the upper inner thigh a week or two before the Armistice in 1918. Of course we don’t know the reason for Tom’s eventual infirmity and eventual demise in ’49 at age 55, however he might have a fair guess.